How she behaves towards other people is one day how she’ll behave towards you

How she behaves towards other people is one day how she’ll behave towards you.

Is she mean to other people?

One day she’s going to be mean to you, probably in the same way she’s mean to others.

Does she like to steal? Does she rationalize stealing?

I’ve run into girls who like taking alcohol from parties, or silverware from restaurants, that kind of thing… they seem proud of it. I haven’t seen the deeper levels of this behavior because the stealing is enough for me to distance myself from them.

Does she somehow always have drama with her friends, bosses, family?

One day she’s going to have drama with you, and by the way the police and courts are going to believe her, not you. Logically you can argue that this is not fair, but it’s true, and you need to protect yourself, not argue about notions of fairness.

Does she spend money poorly or earn money poorly?

One day she’s going to come to you for the money.

Does she tell you stories about kicking out some guy right after sex, for no good reason? Does she tell you stories about being mean to guys who are flirting with her? Those are things that are good to know, because you’re going to be her mean story one day and you should prepare appropriately. If she is proud of being mean to other people, one day she’s going to be proud of being mean to you.

Everyone has moments of untoward behavior, including me. If you somehow made a montage of my worst moments I would look bad. Things are grey, not black and white. But when you are building a model of a woman, or of anyone, take into account the red flags. I have been a low-down dirty dog. I’ve also been very effective and enabled experiences that would otherwise not have happened.

Other people are going to judge you the same way. I have lost people because of my interpersonal proclivities. That’s fine, it’s a cost of being alive and living a full life in my view. I do the things I do and pay the price for them, like we all do. But you should decide who you are and what kinds of things you’ll accept in people and what kinds of things you won’t. If you don’t, you’ll get what you get, and then you’ll bear the costs.

“Open marriage considerations”

“Open marriage considerations” is a post by Rakish Love.

I used to believe that an open marriage is a good end-game for seducers, but after this past year I am reconsidering this. Here’s the rub: an Open Marriage is only good if you have a high number of leads available at a given time.

I write that open relationships and even marriages usually work best when the couple interacts most commonly with other couples. If the man and the woman separately pursue their interests, the man is almost always going to have a lot more problems. Women who signal openness to casual sex will be overwhelmed by men. Men who do the same will usually not be.

Marriage is dangerous: the man’s wife can decide she luvs another guy and then, in the United States, take half the man’s assets and often part of his earnings for many years to come. Pair-bonding with another guy increases the probability of this happening.

I don’t know a lot about Rakish Love’s background or arrangement but it also seems that, once a marriage is opened, it’s often very hard to close it again, particularly if one party (usually the woman) is successfully f**king other people and the other party is not. New relationship energy (NRE) is a powerful force that destroys many conventional marriages.

I will also commend guys writing honestly online about the bad/dark parts of game, non-monogamy, etc. I have read far too many guys with extremely unlikely stories, success rates, experiences, etc., but in reality very little in male-female interaction/sexuality is 100% good or 100% bad. Stories by guys who are always 100% killing it and getting the hottest chicks…  I don’t really believe them. I don’t see anyone who is always doing great, always getting the hottest chicks and retaining them, etc. There are more greys than blacks/whites.

Reciprocity & value.

European sex club report

(I’ve been talking to this player on Twitter. English isn’t his first language. This is his story, but he wants to remain anonymous right now.)

Sex-positive environments are a unique place: you know that the people there are there for couple of reasons only. They want to open the release steam valve of their perversions (master and slaves, FemDom and all that kind of “beat me” stuff – how a man can feel pleasure in getting kicked in the balls is real hard for me to understand) or to experience hedonism in full colours, and boy, it is fun.

I’ve previously been to a sex-positive club and I was shocked by what happens in these parties: my idea was a bunch of 50 years old that swap their old hag for a bit of “fresh meat” thrill, but I was surprised to see young and attractive girls together with a bunch of equally attractive males. If you have to orgy, orgy hard Daddy.

In these parties, since it’s obvious that everybody is there for sex, you would think that you just walk to a hot chick, pull her hand on your cock and let the magic happens, well, that’s not really what happens…in theory.

Friday night I left for a famous party in Berlin at a famous place that organize these events: the dress code was fetish, so you have bunch of people all leathered up or basically in their underwear – what a magical filter to have for attraction, uh – I love to wear a bad biker outfit with my vest open – this is a form of peacock since 95% of men inside will have terrible bodies, eating too much sugar and drinking beer, if you drink, stick to whiskey, pal.

As a PUA, since you know what kind of social environment you are entering into, you can prepare and out maneuver any kind of competition thanks to game knowledge.

The biggest DHV you can have in these places is to have a good looking girl under your arm, but if you don’t, GAME will be fundamental.

I approached directly a stunning hot blonde in the dungeon and after she blushed, and she immediately shit tested me “Who are you with here.” I will get shit tested on my thirstiness couple of times in this interaction but never on my frame, interestingly enough girls are worried more of thirsty betas than a guy willing to spank her with a whip, frame, uh?

In these places is normal to find hot girls who need to let their slut side go and party hard, ending up in a gangbang or getting tied up to a wooden X and whipped till their body turn red – I replied with something like I parked my subs outside to a pole (do not say something like this in a different environment) and we started vibing: me stacking about her leather outfit (leather stripes going around the body) and then she introduced me to her friend… again, game aficionados would know what a cockblock is but in this context you can use at your advantage (in my case I said who was the master and who slaps who and started spike them both), and my wing comes at the right time but he almost doesn’t notice the set, yet the timing is amazing and I DHV him right in about his crazy shibari skills, while he story tells the friend. I take the chance to take my target to smoke a cigarette (I don’t smoke, the plan was just isolation).

A lot more spikes and locations changes (I have a mini flogger that she wanted to try while bent over a couch), then I asked her to go upstairs to play in privacy (code name for “let’s go fuck”) and she accepts… I take her hand and lead upstairs to a semi dark room with a big bed in it, a little bit of kino and flogging and I decide it’s time to go big or home, I pull my dick out in front of her face and she reaches for it, BOOM +1!

I take her number and her friend is still downstairs with my wing, who had already used the load while an old lady was gang banged by 6 guys with her husband watching… I owe him a lot for going through this. Once the girls reconnect downstairs, her friend says she got something and proceed to speak German – my girl says she will be back in a bit and they disappear together in the toilet (I suspect ecstasy, but who am I to judge?) I will never see her again.

Together with my wing we venture again in the dungeon and he introduces to a tranny that he knows who knows a ton of people, HE/SHE (whatever floats your boat) introduces me to the friend, a blonde chick next to that who immediately notices the flogger (I swear, how many chicks these days know what it is and what is it for) and teases me if I ever used it, I simply reply that if she behaves good with me maybe I will show her.

In reality, the chick is there only to cocktease since her boyfriend is the big guy at the door and she won’t do anything without him…oh well, at least I tried.

I also opened an older woman, because she had a busty body that made me very horny. An interesting thing here for players is couples.

A lot of couple will play with you if you have something to offer, maybe you have a Spartan warrior body, maybe you have an hot girl with you, maybe they just buy your frame, whatever, but a lot of couples will actually participate in games, in this case, as soon as this woman told me “I would like to play with you but I need to ask my husband” I understood that this one was either a total strike with a cuckoo or he would have just dismissed me because of their couple agreement.

Every couple has agreements like “I do the garbage you do the dishes” but they also have agreements on sex clubs, like “we must both bang – if you want to bang I select the man – we go together we live together ” etc. etc.

Turns out the man is a great guy, I started throwing DHVs on how I live life on my terms, after this trip I will go into the woods for a mini survival training (men love this, I’d love to meet people like this too where I’m from) he said they are busy tonight but he number close me to politely dismiss me, I guess their agreement was if you bring a guy, I must fuck what girl he brings – ahh, swingers, you gotta love them.

(Red Quest again: In my experience it’s more common for this sort of thing to happen in circumstances where the guy already has a good reputation and reception. I don’t know how well known the writer of this field report is in this club or scene. I’ve also heard Europe is better for sex clubs than anywhere else in the world. Most of the time, the sex clubs work when you are bringing a girl to the club. This player might be extremely high value on his own or have a reputation there. )

Why nurses or teachers are positive signs for longer-term relationships

Hard-core players who want to f**k around can ignore this one, but I mentioned to a player that teachers and nurses are good female occupations for long-term partners. Why?

smart men looking for a long-term partner should look at a woman’s job situation… a woman out of school who has no work or work history whatever is probably showing that there is something wrong with her… but a woman in a corporate job is not that appealing to most similarly situated men. When I am evaluating women for long term situations, two jobs in particular stand out, teacher and nurse. They are both jobs that are easy to leave at the job (don’t demand 50+ hour weeks) and they are both jobs that make it easy to leave for a year or two to have a family.

There are a lot of women who bring nothing to relationships apart from their p***ies… and then they are surprised… where are the GOOD men?

Teachers and nurses make fine money and both jobs can easily be left at work, unlike many modern corporate jobs. Both of them have a caring / empathy component that is good for men. Both jobs are easy to leave for a couple years to do child-bearing and early rearing. Both jobs convey that a woman is smart enough to get into a line of work that’s super compatible with having a family. Obviously, there are many teachers and nurses who would make terrible long-term partners, so you don’t need to tell me that in the comments. I know that and so do you.

It’s also true that some corporate women or flakey artistic bohemians who would make good long-term partners. Judge an individual in her totality, not just her profession. But if I hear “teacher” or “nurse,” that’s a grain of sand on the “long-term partner” side of the scale, and if I hear “boring corporate harridan” that’s a grain on the other side. If a nurse starts telling me about how she cuts herself, how she hates men because of her non-existent relationship with her father, and about how she is a women’s “rights” (special privilege) advocate… then she’s out and it’s on to the next one. A boring corporate harridan who talks about how she has chosen a set of skills and abilities that make it easy for her to have a family… about how she prioritizes family over work… about how she is close with her parents… that’s the opposite…. she’s a good choice… a sign of something is not the thing itself.

Age discrepancy is also an important question for longer-term relationships. I’m very unlikely to get into a serious relationship with a woman younger than 25 or who is still in school. That way lies madness. Yes, younger-hotter-tighter is cool, but that’s also setting yourself up for dissolution and, worse, divorce. The number of exceptions here is super small. If the age gap gets too large, a man is probably setting himself up for failure. If I met the right 23 year old who wanted to be a co-parent… maybe… but we’re also getting to very unusual fringe corner cases.

Yes, it is possible to consciously seek and seed a co-parenting relationship with a much younger women… I know another player who seems to be doing something like this… but it’s so rare that I mention it to be complete without expecting it to be relevant to most guys. If you want such an arrangement and find such a relationship, congratulations, but I don’t think many of them are out there.

Unlike some of the guys excreting their bile online, I’m also fine with the woman making more money than the man, if many other factors are in her favor. Many guys are insecure or threatened by this notion, but I’m not. If she makes $$$$, that’s nice, but the number of attractive women who make a lot of money and also have other good characteristics for long-term partners… we’re again talking about a super small group. I have run into some, most of them being physicians. It’s like hot female engineers… I have run into one or two of them, too… they’re super rare as well. Generic advice needs to aim for the median cases, not the cases three and four standard deviations out there. There are many millions of attractive teachers and nurses out there, some of them young and cute, and the jobs are easy enough to train for and get that they don’t exclude the overwhelming majority of hot chicks, as engineering, computer science, starting your own company, and law tend to do.

“First swingers clubs,” from a player in a forum

“First swingers clubs“… a guy named Sailors Grave writes in the good looking loser forum. The content is average and there is nothing ground-breaking in his field report, but apart from black dragon he’s the first example I’ve seen of a player talking about swinging and sex parties.

I stumbled onto it by accident but it’s so unusual to find a player speaking to this domain that I’m linking it up. Have you seen other players figure this out?

Combining non-monogamy, game, and sex clubs to unlock abundance and commodification

A player I know says he was talking to a wing about the sex clubs and some of his ecosystems,

It seems that the feeling now for me is that when you channel a girl’s promiscuous side, they are subconsciously signalling to you that they are not a good choice for children due to paternity issues. The other feeling I’m getting is that all women are exchangeable – you can just trade and find a new one that suits you better. I’ve never felt like that. The talk about “Frame” seems to center on controlling a woman’s sexuality … but after going to a sex party I don’t really care what the women does if I don’t want children with her. Some very new feelings for me and not very palatable for the average red pill or tradcon commentator.

I’m not as sure about the good choice for children, cause some women going to sex clubs still want children and have (should have) the forebrain, conscious ability to be monogamous with a man in order to conceive. A lot of men are not as eager for these women as primary partners, however. But “The other feeling I’m getting is that all women are exchangeable – you can just trade and find a new one that suits you better. I’ve never felt like that,” that is accurate and true to my experience. I feel for this player, cause I’ve been feeling like that for a while… and I’ve actually become kind of weary of that feeling… which doesn’t make a huge amount of sense but it’s true. It’s the thinking behind why women hate the demystification of romance and mating offered by the game. When players build value and learn attraction triggers and game, we can move to the abundance mentality that is much-discussed online. The non-monogamy raises and increases the abundance.

This only works for the guy with some underlying value, some game, and a functioning environment (big city). If a guy has true abundance… if he has more than he can handle… he’s not so worried about controlling women’s sexuality… she should be worried about controlling her own sexuality in order to entice him. Women over time become more worried about controlling his attention and resources. When guys online write about “making her chase,” this is what they’re talking about… but it only really works after the woman has invested, not before. For a non-elite man, trying to “make her chase” when she knows nothing about you is foolish, because there is nothing for her to chase. When she figures out you are not a commodity guy, then there is.

Most women are the same… but not all of them… it takes a lot of experience to recognize the genuinely non-commodity woman. Most guys going on about their angel who isn’t like other girls… don’t realize she’s not an angel… she is like other girls… he’s just blinding himself to the obvious. Until he finds her in bed with another man, divorced, etc.

To me… the sex clubs shift female sexuality TOWARDS commodification, which can be a benefit to guys. This is what the “LOL cuck” guys miss, because they can’t imagine a different world from the scarcity one they inhabit. The player I’ve been talking to is seeing the world in a different way, based on experiences that are foreclosed to most guys. He is now seeing the secret society, which most guys don’t (can’t) do.

If you’ve read this piece, you’ll like the free book, too.

Basics like asking the girl out and escalation

For most guys, 97% or more, it’s still about the basics… this story is copied from a woman on Twitter, although the woman, under the name “Mom Folding Laundry” (don’t ask me why she picked that pseudonym) eventually deleted her account,

at some point during the courtship dance, you DO need to let her know you are interested. Sexually. Because, believe it or not, she may not know.

This is a funny story from my own dating days.

In my mid-20s, I played ultimate frisbee. One day, a couple guys joined our game. One blond, the other dark haired. Blond guy was SUPER attractive and extremely good at ultimate frisbee. They both came to our after-game potluck. I can’t recall what happened, but I didn’t really consider either of them dating options. However, I did get the dark haired one’s number.

And one night when I was bored, called him for a drink. NOT because I was into him. I really just wanted to leave the house. So I have a drink with the guy, and the whole time, he’s singing the praises of his blond friend. So much that I’m wondering if he’s trying to tell me he’s gay. I was super confused.

Then, some time later, he invited me for dinner with him…and blond friend. Like…okay?

But that was THE ENTIRETY of my contact with these guys. A year and a half later, I ran into Blond Guy. I told him I was engaged to my husband. Blond Guy said, “Why did you pick him over me?”

0.0
O.o
O.0

Like…this was a guy who IN NO WAY made it clear he liked me. He didnt ask me out. He didnt try to kiss me. He didnt even have his friend pass me a note like we were in middle school to tell me he liked me. HOW was I to know?!?!?!? And this was a HANDSOME guy. An athletic guy.

But even he couldn’t date properly.

This is a failure of basic escalation. Super basic. Both guys in the story fail.

A lot of guys will succeed by improving their value, talking to chicks, asking chicks out, showing straightforward interest, and then trying to f**k them. The advanced game stuff you read… that’s the back 10 or 20%…. most guys don’t have the first 80 or 90% down… the stuff that’s like, “Have some balls.” “Make a move.” “Don’t be afraid of rejection.” “Rejection is better than regret.” “Hit the gym.”

In real life, I have heard many MANY women tell stories similar to this woman’s story. Most guys aren’t even taking the easy shots.

In real life, I was like those clueless guys until I was like 20 / 21.

How many women do you think those guys missed because they didn’t say, “Give me your phone number, and let’s get a drink.” Because they didn’t say, “Why don’t we go back to my place and listen to music / watch a movie?” Back at his place, kiss her. Then the rest. A lot of guys will be helped just by looking the girl in the eye and escalating. So that she knows he’s interested. Sexually.

This chick was so potentially into them that SHE CALLED THEM. That doesn’t happen much. And one or both of them still botched it by not escalating, at all.

Women have these kinds of stories (the linked woman is not a PC SJW lunatic, so that’s cool… not every woman on Twitter is a raving SJW lunatic). Guys they might have f**ked if the guy had made the move. I am interested in exploring the back half of the game that is very little discussed, while also knowing that this woman is right, most guys are guilty of, “IN NO WAY made it clear he liked me.” Most guys “couldn’t date properly.” That means super basic escalation. A lot of girls aren’t getting f**ked, and a lot of guys aren’t f**king, because the guy doesn’t do super simple escalation. I have written this before, but a decent number of my lays came about from girls who were kind of passive or awkward… but who went along… with me… back to my place until we were f**king. A lot of guys in normal life who are considered “players” just have good eye contact, decent bodies, and they escalate until the girl says no…. and sometimes she never says no.

“The stripper with the sugar daddy”

“The stripper with the sugar daddy” is my version of the title… let’s be real here, she’s no computer scientist… she does have a typical alpha/beta boyfriend dynamic going on, though… “I’m leery of his avoidant attachment style but, like my weekend shifts at the club, the promise of pleasure lures me back again and again,” the usual, honey…

I’m also beginning to realize I’m torn between A and B. B is reliable, empathetic, open, everything I am not used to in men — but deep down I know I am not as into him as he is into me. I find myself drawn to the 10,000-piece puzzle that is A. Even though he is evasive and maddeningly frustrating, I realize that I am in love with him.

It’s like reading red pill fan fic… the boring guy is too boring for her, the exciting guy is exciting because he’s unreliably available. With A, there’s a little “accident,”

We go back to his place and fuck passionately for hours, in every position. I love making you come, he whispers, kissing the back of my neck. When he’s about to finish he asks, can I come in you, but I hear, can I come on you, and tell him of course. I am shocked when I feel myself getting filled with something. It’s been a long time since I let someone do that, for me it’s as intimate as it is risky.

B, however,

sends me a link to a playlist he’s made. I listen to it before work and realize it’s a love letter. I am flooded with conflicting emotions. He knows I dance and thinks its “fucking badass,” which is a rarity; he’s a feminist, a real one. We are compatible on so many levels but there is something missing for me.

She likes him but is an avoidant type herself… so B’s statements of attraction to her turn her off… while A’s distance turns her on. Different types women of women will be turned on by different things. This is not a chick who likes comfort or needs much of it. This is a chick who likes wild uncertainty. The more sexually open and fluid she is, the more likely she is to be turned on by game playing, hot-cold, push-pull, etc. Know your audience.

Finishing inside is a universal path to intimacy and connection, however.

 

 

Brief one about limited interactions at a sex party

Went to another closed sex party Saturday night, and as I began to write this I thought back on The Tom Torero lay report book, “Below the Belt”,

Should you read it? I dunno. If you want more lay reports, then sure. If you’ve already read a bunch of them, as I have, then I don’t know if it’s that useful. They do get repetitive, and that sense of repetition may be part of what’s making me thinking about the next part of my life.

Same thing here, cause a lot of the older sex club reports (the ones I didn’t write cause I wasn’t writing then) would look like this one… went to the party, hosted by some friends. Maybe 100 people there total? Enjoyed it overall and chatted with some people. Not a lot of really good looking girls, but three or four 7+s. Had a couple with a hot girl offer a swap, so that was fun. Declined it, though. Precedent: don’t want to go there right now.

Sex parties, lots of people f**king together in the same space, it’s just very… stimulating. Stimulating in a way impossible to explain without experiencing it. The group dynamic makes everyone f**k better, improves focus, offers encouragement. There’s an undercurrent of feeling that we’re all getting one over on societal rules… that feeling players know… but it’s present here as well. Even if you don’t interact too much with other people, it can be a fun place. The stimulation is there even without f**king another woman. I’ve actually transacted a bit of business at these events, too, cause you never know who’s going to be at them. I’ve seen couples who go regularly but never go beyond touching or kissing other people. They get some of their jollies from the environment, without wanting to risk their primary relationship. Compared to the typical getting drunk and being bored and then being hung over the next day, this is a big improvement. Everyone wants to f**k anyway… better to skip the pretense.

There were a few too many fat chicks for my taste, and more shifty guys than I would have liked, if you know what I mean. Wasn’t enough to make me leave, but I noted it. There was also a small cute girl there who I’ve met before but who has the glassy-eyed, thousand-cock stare that I’m not a fan of. I’m sure some hater guys who have never been think all the chicks there are like that, but that’s not been my experience… most of them have a pretty well-integrated sexuality, a sexuality that their forebrain and hindbrains agree with, and that prevents the vacant look of women who use sex or their bodies for attention, as transactions, etc. This one… I can’t place her. Have not been inside her but have thought about having a go. Something seems a little off about her, and that plus wanting to establish good precedent holds me back. I also need to be congruent. If I am not congruent in what I think I should be doing and what I do, that is going to f**k me up.

Saturday morning I also went out for coffee with my date, and there was a couple sitting across from us. Struck up a bit of a conversation over something, can’t remember what… I found the girl unbelievably sexy, but I’m not sure why exactly… something about the way she moved, or her vibe. The pants she was wearing, somewhere between yoga pants and sweatpants, just made her ass look fantastic. The guy was more interesting than average too. They both looked like they’d just rolled out of bed. Probably won’t go anywhere, but the old ways and habits die hard. I dropped a strategic drug reference in, and that went over well. I get the vibe from them, probably because I really want to get the vibe.

It also appears that Torero has killed his whole online presence, so if you want the book, speak up and maybe it will find its way to you.

“Why 16? Who do age of consent laws really protect” A dangerous story, too

There’s a story in the second half of this one……. about me turning tail and running.

Why 16? Who do age of consent laws really protect. Rare to see these ideas questioned, because they serve two groups’s interests: older women voters and parents. Obviously older women parents really see their interests served, but fathers don’t want to watch their daughters make typical re/tarded romantic decisions and get pregnant by charming older players. Charming teen players are bad enough. Throw in experienced seducers with teen girl morons and the teen girls risk pregnancy, heartbreak, etc., while their parents risk having to mop up the mess.

Parents don’t give a shit about abstract arguments regarding right, wrong, consistency, etc. That shit’s for the philosophers. Parents just want their daughters to be less likely to get pregnant, get STIs, become dick drunk, etc. Don’t underestimate the power of the last one… if you are a player you’ve seen chicks go out of their minds with desire, at least temporarily, and a decent number of dads remember women who went crazy with love/lust. They want to avoid that condition in teen girls if at all possible. Don’t think your arguments about reason, autonomy, women being their own bosses, etc. are going to persuade the parents who have to deal with seduction’s aftermath. Adult women have a hard enough time, as we can see from the number of women bearing children out of wedlock.

Plus… women who are over the age of 18 and especially over the age of 25/30 can’t effectively compete with younger chicks. How do you avoid competition? Outlaw the possible competitors.