How to think about “future projection” on dates, and how to retain girls better

Sometime along the way to being a player, I figured out that it’s often useful to say something about date 2 when I’m on date 1 with a girl: mention cooking, for example, and say, “Come over for dinner, next time.” Then set a date, usually two days from the moment of the date. So if the date is Tuesday, shoot for Thursday, and feel out her schedule, and schedule that date.[1] Making things happen is man frame, accepting offers is woman frame. Text her the next day, “Good seeing you yesterday, and I’m looking forward to seeing you tomorrow at [time].” She can decline the date at that point (and sometimes does, it happens, it’s all in the game). My classic strategy has been one or two bars on date 1, then try to bounce her home, if possible, and my working theory has been that she’ll respect the effort to lay her, and the boldness, even if she says no. Magnum has used a two-date model successfully, which seems to reduce flakiness and female rejection due to self-perceived negative sluttiness. He thinks the two-date model helps with retention, and he may be right about that, although if the girl feels “on” during date one, he’ll lay her or at least try.

Game is about balancing tension and comfort, and I think most guys who get into the game and studying the game are nerds who tend towards too much comfort and insufficient edge.

Continue reading “How to think about “future projection” on dates, and how to retain girls better”

Paying for women (no, not that way: on dates)

Xbtusd tackles a perennial topic, coming at it from a different angle: should the guy pay on dates?

I have a distinct memory from high school, of a girl I was interested in, explaining how attractive women procure alcohol: she said they flirt with older guys who have fake IDs, giving the older guys the impression a hookup might be available, and then leverage that relationship to get alcohol.  I was furious when I learned this, but eventually asked the girls to ask the guys to buy me alcohol without telling the dudes it was for another dude.  Today we would call those dudes “simps,” but back then pretty much everyone was a simp.  Dudes with cars would DD (“designated driver”) for carloads of women ferrying them around from party to party and back to their houses all over town.  Often, these dudes didn’t even think they could hook up with the girls, they just wanted to be needed by attractive women for something.  To feel validated as a human and potential sexual option.  To feel seen.

That experience left a strong emotional mark on me at a formative age, and I vowed I’d never be like those pathetic losers.  In many ways that early experience served me, since they taught me to always avoid situations where you are giving away value and getting nothing.  In other ways I’ve hewed too strongly to this principle, for fear of the humiliation I associate with finding out I’ve been manipulated and turned into a simp.  

In college, I was at a school where fraternities dominated the social scene.  I joined one of the most prominent frats and had the time of my life running the school’s social life.  Frats were an interesting social element because we simped for women, but always made sure it was transactional.  We spent tons of money throwing amazing parties, providing free alcohol to women, and, in exchange, the pussy flowed freely.  Most guys wish they had the opportunity to “pay,” however indirectly, for pussy in the way we did.  And yet, there were still nuances to the game.  A rival fraternity that some friends were in, took the simping way too far.  They shamelessly catered to women, playing whatever “gay” song of the day was on the top of all the freshman girls’ iPods at dance parties, and preparing non-beer drinks (unheard of) to get all the young girls who didn’t drink beer yet, drunk.  The more they swallowed their pride and gave the women what they wanted, the more their penises were swallowed by the youngest and hottest girls.  And yet, no girl who was not a freshman would be seen dead there, even if that’s where she had spent the majority of her freshman year.

There’s clearly some line where simping works, in the sense of “doing things for women,” but when you go too far, you lower your value, and women lose respect for you. Smart guys find that line. Where does courtesy end, and simping begin? Which brings me to my question: to pay or not to pay for women on dates?  I’ve always been of the opinion that if the woman wants to split, I split, and, if not, I assume I’ll pay: but I never insist and I don’t give them any pushback.

My girlfriend went on a first date with a guy last week, and one of the things she remarked on was that while she was in the bathroom he paid the bill without her knowing.  When he was ready to go he was like, “let’s get out of here,” and when she inquired about the bill he cooly remarked that he’d already taken care of it.  Smooth.  She considers herself a feminist, and has always insisted on paying half on dates, and she historically has gone on a lot of dates.  I’ve been questioning her reasoning, now that we’re in a relationship: why not let the guy pay?

She told me she found it incredibly sexy that he paid for her, and it felt to her similar to how she’s envisioned a sex worker feels. The man desires her so much that he wants to pay for access to her body.  She used the term, “worships my body.”  

On her second date with this guy he invited her to his place and offered to pay for her car home because he lives quite a ways away, and she’d be coming home late.  Again, she was incredibly turned on by this arrangement and said, “fuck feminism, this is so hot.”  

Quite a shift, and an intriguing one.

What’s the difference between simping, and fulfilling a masculine script?

Guys online, hearing his story, might call him a simp. I’d call him successful. 

Note: For context he is 18 years older than her so he is fulfilling a more older gentleman script which might be experienced differently if they were a similar age.

Red Quest here. I think it’s generally wise to pay for early dates, unless she absolutely insists on splitting, or unless you’ve had a miserable date and don’t want to see her again anyway. Protecting value is important, but not at the expense of masculine leadership and identity… though I’ve probably flip-flopped on this issue, depending on mood and recent experiences.

This also seems like an area where girls who are asked, by friends or when sober, will say, “I am a feminist and want to pay half on dates.” When girls are out with a man they’re attracted to, their feminine sides are more assertive, and they’ll like the man behaving like a man, so she can behave like a woman. It’s not what the girl says, it’s what she does… and who she does.

I’ve slept with annoying “feminist” girls who will make dumb claims like “there are no differences between men and women.” If girls make those kinds of claims, I ignore them, or steer the conversation in different directions… my goal is to f**k, not to have political arguments.

After this was published, I read “The Woman Crushing on the Guy From Her Mutual-Aid Group,” which includes the line, “Noah doesn’t buy my Uber home and I’m bitter.” It’s a common mistake to underestimate women’s pettiness and entitlement.

A threesome saga: energy & vibe

XBTUSD is back, now with a threesome story.

I was at an unbelievable, aspirational, can’t-believe-people-live-like-this party last week, thrown by a relatively new friend who lives in a stunning, straight-out-of-Architectural-Digest Brownstone with a stage/amphitheater built into the backyard and hot tub on the roof of the second floor looking into the backyard. The main event was a backyard concert featuring a South American band led by stunningly beautiful women. The host and owner has constructed an incredible universe and filled it with the exact kind of people one wants to spend one’s life around, including “Madison.” The party had the energy of freshman year of college, that first week when everyone is open to meeting new people. Strangely, for this type of event, no one there seemed to know each other. The party started an hour before showtime, so when I arrived everyone was already mingling and getting to know each other.

At one point during the show I was crowded close enough to where Madison stood that it would have been more awkward not to introduce myself, so I did and the conversation naturally flowed. She had an effervescent personality, and we immediately clicked. She was in town from the West coast and wanted tips on what to do while she was in the city. We eventually migrated indoors to have a little more privacy. The conversation quickly moved into intimate topics like sex, sexuality, and non-monogamy. Unsurprisingly she was in an ethically non-monogamous (ENM) relationship, and like most of the sluts I know was bi-sexual.

Around this point my gf joined us and the three of us hit it off.

Continue reading “A threesome saga: energy & vibe”

One of the hard parts about game and dating: when doing nothing is the best option

Game teaches men to control and channel our emotions, but one of the hardest parts about the game, in my experience and, it seems, in many others’, is doing nothing. Saying nothing. Not responding, when every emotional fiber of one’s being cries out to respond. Those are the times when a chick texts something, and I yearn to text back what I think, or to convince her to act, but in my rational mind, I know that saying zero is the right move, and that my emotional yearnings must be curtailed.

“Impatience” is often the handmaiden of failed game. A few days ago, I met a chick I’ve loosely known for about nine months. I have a lot of logistical complexity, and she has some too, and I’ve run hot and cold by accident, because I know I shouldn’t try to bang her, but she’s also a hot 8, and looks and smells like sex, so here I am, wanting to bang her.

Continue reading “One of the hard parts about game and dating: when doing nothing is the best option”

Dating unusual girls who have aspergers, or are non-reactive

Nash has a story about dating a peculiar girl, one who is “cold, confident, powerful little ‘push’ in how she receives you” and who seems to have a “bitchy hot girl routine.” Her responses to him are curt and highly factual, to the point Nash feels like “something is missing.” She’s a mystery (read the whole thing to understand more), and one possibility I posit in the comments: aspergers. She has little apparent interest in other people or a normal social life.

Psych diagnoses are overused today, granted, and lots of guys want to label unhappy chicks as “borderline personality disorder,” while 3/4 of chicks today claim to have “social anxiety disorder,” when the only actual disorder they might have is “7 hours a day staring at my smartphone disorder,” but in this chick, aspergers might fit, and that could also explain the lack of sexual debut, cause she’s too weird and antisocial to get there. I’ve obviously not met the chick Nash is describing, and sometimes it’s hard to say who’s just weird, and who is maybe diagnosably weird, but her behavior as described at least seems consistent with aspergers or similar.

I’ve run into some chicks who are a bit on the spectrum: if a girl likes to f**k for the usual reasons (sensation, orgasm, pleasure) but is also much more logical/systematic than a normal girl, she’s more likely than average to wind up doing non-monogamy, and thus I’m more likely to run into her.

Continue reading “Dating unusual girls who have aspergers, or are non-reactive”

Don’t say anything, and instead change the debate

A player scheduled a date with a chick, then felt ill so he cancelled, then felt better and attempted to un-cancel (or reschedule, I guess) the date. The chick said she’s not free anymore and that she thinks he had other plans, and the other plans got cancelled. She “doesn’t believe in miracles.” Sounds like a girl who’s been around men and dating for a while.

So what would you do? Leave answers in the comments before you read on.

Continue reading “Don’t say anything, and instead change the debate”

Integrating smart drugs, like MDMA (molly), smartly

The average guy who regularly uses drugs like MDMA (molly), coke, etc., may seem from the outside like an idiot and may even be one, but the guys who use MDMA to lead better lives don’t look or act like the average drug idiot. You probably won’t know who they are, unless they tell you, or unless you see them at a venue on a night that’s conducive to the rolling experience. Without having had that experience, it’s impossible to describe how beautiful and life-affirming it can be: and, for those reasons, it can also be a powerful tool in terms of bonding with chicks, and elevating their lives. Loads of girls love different experiences (their typical life is dreary, except when men who up to create some excitement) and it’s possible to intelligently experiment with altered states of mind and body. That almost no guys writing about the game mention this (kind of obvious) point tells us about guys writing about the game… the main exception I can think of is Delicious Tacos, who’s not writing about the game, exactly, but sometimes tweets that the most effective pickup line in the world is, “Hey, want to do some coke?” I’m not saying that should be your line… but he has a point. Loads of guys disparage nightclubs, none of them ever say, “coke is a key part of doing that game successfully.” Personally I don’t want to do coke, but its effectiveness in certain environments remains.

MDMA is better, though, as mentioned above, impossible to describe without having taken it, but it will lower inhibitions, increase tactile sensations, create greater social cohesion, and have some other positive effects, like making people who take it more open and outgoing. A lot of ppl don’t like clubs/raves, then they take MDMA, then they’re suddenly great! If clubs/raves look stupid to you, that’s because you’ve never experienced them on drugs, which is the only way they make sense. Booming nightclubs are horrible environments, unless you’re drunk or on drugs. MDMA is a much better experience than alcohol.

Girls go out and have a couple of drinks on dates because the girls are nervous and they also want to get laid, without their nervous forebrain getting in the way of their p**sies.

Continue reading “Integrating smart drugs, like MDMA (molly), smartly”

“The [male] feminist”

The [male] feminist” is solid reading about a guy who needs a dad or uncle or male cousin to take him aside and tell him to stop being a p***y. Much of what we perceive as social or gender dysfunction is actually, at its heart, family dysfunction and disintegration, and, because of families are smaller and more fractured than they used to be, we don’t know how to become adults, which usually also means “how to become a man” or “how to become a woman.” “The [male] feminist” is most notable for the absence in it, because there’s no mention of this guy’s father or uncle. Where are they? Does his uncle not exist? why not?

There used to be a guy who kept a blog named Goldmund, for example, who, whatever his flaws, talked a lot about his older male relatives and how they influenced his development. Unfortunately his blog has been effectively abandoned… but he’s one of the few guys I’ve seen talk seriously about family and family influence. A lot of “how to be a man” and “how to be a woman” are best conveyed by aunts, uncles, older cousins, those relationships. Default_friend tweeted the other day that she learns a lot from her mom and grandma (can’t find the tweet at the moment), which may help explain why she thinks modern feminism is re/tarded. Camille Paglia writes about the same in her books and essays, about the vital role extended family play in development.

Who or what replaces family? Schools, bureaucracies, ideologies. Except none of those replacements work, it’s like trying to live off McDonald’s and fast food: even if you’re technically alive, you’re barely living. In “The [male] feminist,” the guy absorbs an ideology pitched by power-hungry bureaucrats. The story is exaggerated for effect, I understand that, but normal guys, as they get older, they understand how to discard bullshit that doesn’t work. Even the pathetic snake guys who embrace “I am a feminist” as a way to get laid in high school or college, almost always quit at some point. You get old enough to see an ideology doesn’t work, you quit it. The most interesting part of many stories isn’t what’s in them, but what’s missing.

Chicks aren’t attracted to vulnerability, and the story’s narrator goes around with his belly exposed to every chick he runs into. Chicks like guys they can be vulnerable with, but not guys who are vulnerable. Or the guy is vulnerable is a minor way, like, “I am afraid of heights.” Or maybe, “My ex was super hot but also hurt me badly.” Your hot ex (social proof) hurt you, and now I, a lady, can heal you with my magic pussy? That’s minor vulnerability. Major vulnerability is something like outright incompetence. Competence is attractive to women, which is why effective men work so hard to develop it.

Lots of red pill guys get that masculinity is earned, not given, and that’s why so many primitive tribes have intense male initiation rituals. Femininity is given, not earned, just by going through puberty. That power must be learned to be wielded well, to be sure, but it’s there by showing up… something the male feminist in the story misses.

I don’t remember how the exact conversation went, but Short Dancer admitted that she slept with an incompetent guy her age (who I knew slightly) right before I started f**king her. The guy got her by virtue of proximity and luck, but he lacked masculinity identity and had no one, from what I can tell, to teach him about it. Then I got with Short Dancer, who was diplomatic, but also basically said that he lacked adequate aggression and masculinity. I thought the guy was okay, and if I’d been able to see a way to help him I would have, but, due to some other circumstances, there was no real way to do so. Maybe losing Short Dancer to an older, more masculine guy taught him something important. He seemed like a guy who might identify as a male feminist, although I never heard him actually do so.

Continue reading ““The [male] feminist””

A guy screws up a potential foursome with his endless monologuing

My then-girlfriend and I were propositioned by this couple, and it might have gone through, except for the guy’s personality. We met this couple outside of the open relationship and non-monogamy community because they lived near us and shared some common habits: the girl was a hot European, probably a high 8. We’d encountered them repeatedly, in the neighborhood, and they were friendly and normal at first… the guy also helped us find a small bit MDMA, which is nice). One night we were all drinking a bit and actually getting to know each other, as opposed to idle chitchat. It’s hard to describe the exact feeling, and nothing physical changed, but over the course of the night I felt the energy shift from “normal and friendly” to “this is more than friendly.” I’m sure my girlfriend felt the shift too, as she’d been sufficiently immersed in this world to know.

I wasn’t totally opposed to to the potential foursome (did I mention the girl is stunning?), but, even though my girlfriend and I could feel the sexual interest, the other guy couldn’t shut up. When we were all hanging out, he’d embark on these endlessly long rambles and tangents. Not sharing the conversation is one of my partner’s huge pet peeves, and she’s been annoyed at work when guys talk over her or try to talk over her, and she’d complained repeatedly and vociferously about guys who monologue. Just like this guy was doing. Sharing the conversation is a fundamental aspect of social skills, and this other guy wasn’t doing it. If a person is going to monologue, they better have Chris Rock or Jerry Seinfeld levels of story quality. This guy didn’t.

From what I could distil, they both had super interesting life stories, but we couldn’t extract those life stories, or hear them… I was thinking of the guy when I wrote Curiosity leads to sexual freedom… and threesomes… and storytelling, although he’s not the only one who’s had this problem.

Continue reading “A guy screws up a potential foursome with his endless monologuing”

Breaking it off with the secret affair girl

Broke it off with the girl from Women having affairs never make you use a condom, after seeing her, I don’t know, five or six times… it was very nice, and yet after each time I found myself thinking the kind of things I’ve talked about on here before, like, “You can only have one or two main priorities in your life, and a couple secondary priorities, and after that you’re out of time and energy.” A lot of people fail to have a single main priority, besides something like video games or stuffing their face with sugar, and it shows. My main priority right now should not be chasing random skirt, as doing so is not consistent with my overall life goals. Problem being, when I think I can get a cute girl to pliantly spread her legs, my hindbrain says, “SCORE” and my forebrain is missing in action. When the girl and her perky tits and flat stomach are somewhere else, the forebrain can better assert control and whisper, “WTF are you doing with your life?”, and I have to admit the forebrain has control.

We met in a neutral venue, as usual, f**ked very thoroughly, also as usual, and after that we got underwear back on and I broached the topic.

Continue reading “Breaking it off with the secret affair girl”