BDSM dates & sex skills & online dating

Most guys still don’t know and can’t do BDSM, but Yoylo, who is working the game says, “I know it sounds a weird request – but how would you stage a sex date with a girl who has complained all her life about sex not being rough enough? I’m planning the date with the MILF for next week.”

Not odd/weird… there are lots of things to do… if you have space and money for a spanking bench, that is a nice touch (etsy seems to be the place to buy them, don’t know why, but check your local sex shops too). Many apartments/flats are too small for spanking benches. In thinking about BDSM… do the slow/teasing leadup… most girls complain that guys go too fast and are in too much of a hurry… so do the opposite. Sex skills for guys, and this one about vibrators, are also good posts with actionable advice applicable to BDSM dates.

Once you have read those two… you’ll understand some basics, so we’ll start when the chick is back at your apartment. If it’s one-on-one, start with kissing her, holding her neck, etc. When she is ready, collar her and put wrist and ankle restraints on her. You might use them, you might not. I wouldn’t gag her the first time, tempting as it is.

Have nipple clamps (key) and a collar.

Be ready with a butt plug and lube.

Talk dirty, tell her she’s a slut, etc.

As you are kissing her, strip her as typical when leading to sex. Play with her nipples and see how sensitive they are. If they’re very sensitive, she probably won’t like clamps. If they’re less sensitive, she’s more likely to. Don’t use clamps immediately, but when she’s very warmed up see if she’s interested in having them on her.

Eventually she’ll only be wearing her panties (assuming she’s wearing any). While she’s still standing, bend her over partially and begin spanking her. If you’ve never spanked a woman before, “How to spank a woman” in a search engine will give you good resources for this. Alternate spanking and caressing. Pay attention to her sounds and body. You may go back and forth with a paddle, or with a flogger.

It’s also reasonable to engage a leather paddle. Move to a wood one if you think she is not reaching her terminus. If you are swinging a wood paddle like a baseball bat and connecting with her ass… and it is not enough… then she is going into places I (personally) don’t want want to go. It’s getting too close to something like torture instead of bondage. There are chicks who go for that… I find it to be a real turnoff when she’s into that level of pain/suffering. For newbie chicks, hands and paddles are usually sufficient.

At some point you want to slide your hands in and begin touching her clit. If you’ve spanked her well and her body responds well, she will probably already be wet. This can go on for as little as four or five minutes or as long as 20 or 30, intermittently, with some gentle caressing in between.

Move her to the bed at some point, or the bench mentioned earlier. Like with sex, it’s not a bad idea to move spaces once or twice. Not so much as to break flow, but enough to keep her from getting bored or too acclimated. And go a little more slowly than you think. It’s tempting to just ratchet up rapidly. If you sense she’s getting bored or restless, ratchet up more quickly. For a lot of chicks, anticipation is as good or better than the execution.

Play with the restraints and with blindfolds. When she’s been spanked well, tie her to the bed and try going down on her and you will likely get a great response, for example. At some point just f**k her as you normally would, but incorporate spanking and choking into it. Hold her collar, lightly, perhaps. This can be dangerous because you don’t want to hurt her windpipe, so be careful with it.

Some chicks who like needles and who like a level of pain and bruising I’m not into. This chick would send me pictures of her entire ass and upper thighs turning black with bruising. I would hit her HARD with paddles, and she seemed to… not shrug it off, but I was not touching her innermost space. I consciously decided she goes too far for me… I don’t want to really beat up a woman, or leave her like that chick liked. I don’t want to mess with needles and blood. I have seen chicks who like that and I’m just not interested and don’t find it erotic. These girls are pretty rare.

Like with sex or symphonies, it’s good to have some mini crescendos, then back off, then build up again.

Like with business, proper preparation is ideal. For chicks, guys make things “just happen” so that the chick doesn’t have to do anything besides pick her outfit and bend over. Chicks live in a world where they just show up… and the guy has done the work… so do the work. Feminism’s noise about “equality” is bullshit. Most chicks want an experienced guy to show them the way.

So that’s my step-by-step towards a chick who has never had it rough enough. This is a scaleable action plan, because some chicks just want a little light spanking and paddling, which they’ve never had from their pussy, feminist boyfriends. Some chicks want extreme pain that I don’t want to get to. Most chicks won’t know where they are until you take them there, and ideally the chick will say “yellow” if you get her to that end state. A good dom is monitoring the chick carefully and backing off when necessary.

I don’t think Yoylo, who asked, really needed the above… it sounds like he’d gotten it all figured out before my reply and was prepared, but he was also ready to change based on the feel of the mood and other contingencies. Being prepared decreases any stress or anxiety in the moment… I have done a little description of prep to friends who say that it sounds like a lot of work. But then I point out that advance work improves the moment because you don’t have to worry about where the paddle is, whether the cuffs are available, how to tie her up, how to release her, etc.

Also, you don’t have to use the equipment at all, or not all of it, every time. You can just use what feels right and if she’s fatigued or you’re just done, you can have it and not need it. Like firearms and condoms, better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

My sense is that the BDSM market is not tapped properly online, unlike the general market. This guy, Andy has/had a BDSM Tinder profile that seems to have worked well for him. Will it work for you? No idea… if I had to try online dating again I would give this a shot, given how terrible most online dating has become. You have to decide for yourself.

How to frame and execute nude photo shoots with women

A player, “Mr. V.,” who knows about my nude photography art habit, asks how I do it… I’ve talked about the principles before, but now for some detail…

  • After sex, I tell her to pose, or to hold, then I grab the camera and start shooting… a real, standalone camera. Sometimes I’ll tell her the light looks good or she looks good right there, that kind of thing that makes her purr. Something to make her think that it’s not random jerk-off material but artistic. Girls have been going for the “You look special just now, spread your legs” line since primitive men first took charcoal to cave walls. It worked for Picasso, it worked for Lucian Freud, it worked well enough for that weird artistic guy with long hair in undergrad art classes, it will work fine for you if you’re high value, have good game, and the girl is in your frame. Sometimes I’ll say something about her being especially attractive. After sex, women are eager to hear they’re still sexy, desirable, and good, and that the guy doesn’t dislike them during post-nut clarity. Snuggling, cuddling, and bonding during this period is important. She needs male attention to come back down to the regular world. And… they are still in a sex-positive mood and receptive to the camera’s eye.
  • From there I just kind of assume the sale and turn on the camera while we’re fucking or beforehand. Or I’ll say, “We should make a sex tape,” then do it. I almost never ask explicitly… very much try to assume the sale. Most women will go along with this in the moment, particularly if they’re already turned on.
  • Because the woman is turned on already, that may be why a lot of chicks will ask the next day for me to delete the photos… she gets caught up in the moment while aroused. The next day, in a cold state, she worries about her reputation, shame, etc. What if it gets out? I am the kind of gentleman who will tell her that I deleted them.
  • The number who refuse pics altogether is small… but out there. It’s all in the game.
  • Sometimes I start out with only her backside (no face) and then move forward. Like with a lot of things, chicks might start out uncomfortable with things but then inch into full comfort. The more invested she is, the more likely she’ll want to serve as your muse and model.
  • Having a true standalone camera produces superior results and also feels different to the woman than a guy with a phone. She feels more like a desired model. Every guy has a phone. Be different.
  • Some chicks will show the results to their friends. This seems like a demonstration of higher value (DHV).
  • If she’s a hard no, let it go. A playful disposition will often help her overcome initial shyness.
  • It is good to learn basic photography.

If she’s a hard “no” accept that. There is “yes,” “maybe” “soft (negotiable) no” and “hard no.” Negotiation is the subject of many books so I won’t write a whole thing about it now. Recognizing the hard no and the soft no is a job of the player.

When a woman sends nudes before sex it’s a bad sign, in my experience. Still not 100% sure why but I have some theories in the other post. I personally haven’t gotten a lot of this but I’ve seen a little. I also don’t request nudes from women, almost ever. I think requesting phone nudes is a demonstration of lower value (DLV) and also most women are inept photographers with inept cameras, poor light, and poor composition.

Threesome management. How to do and arrange FFM and MFM

Some people think threesomes “just happen” and while some threesomes can, guys who do non-monogamy look for the principles and patterns underlying threesomes (besides drugs and circumstance… not my favorite routes). The biggest principles are reciprocity and bringing value. In an MFM threesome, the value can come from just being able to set up and execute the scene… lots of women have MFM fantasies but find them very hard to bring to fruition, since most guys are very touchy about this topic and afraid of losing their one and only girl. In many couples, there will be an agreement to do an FMF, then do an MFM, but one person will be eager to do the threesome that is in their favor then don’t want to reciprocate, leading to the usual hurt feelings, drama, cries of double standards and hypocrisy, etc. Girls are very used to guys eager for FMF but who won’t seriously entertain MFM. It is possible to gun for FMF (here is Magnus’s story, doing that), but guys who can pull off MFM are even rarer.

Where there is a shortage there is an opportunity, and smart guys ruthlessly exploit sexual marketplace arbitrage opportunties. A shortage of guys who will fulfill a woman’s fantasy means higher value for a guy who can. If you want some evidence of the depraved sex in the female imagination, the Nancy Friday book MY SECRET GARDEN is a good start….. so are her other books…. or just read any of the websites devoted to chicks anonymously describing what they fantasize about. You may run into chicks with unfulfilled MFM threesome fantasies and, if you do, it is a decent idea to have a buddy who is good at threesomes…. I figured that out a while ago and my friend “John” has played that role for me, and me for him. We don’t keep score any more (no point), although I think we are both transitioning out of this space and into other roles. Some guys will say, “Cool, I get laid” to a proposed threesome but won’t want to go through with it with it for fear of appearing gay, etc. Some will also be happy to f**k a chick when you do all the work and then not reciprocate by bringing a girl back to you.

When you can find a guy in decent shape, who is not afraid of being perceived as “gay,” who is okay in bed, and who will reciprocate… that is powerful. You can get into situations where a girl will confess her MFM threesome fantasy and then you can say, “If you are serious about making it happen then we can make it happen.”

I’m sure some guys will say “MFM is gay” or “real men never do it.” Fine, they can stop reading. To make it happen, I have most often either been with a girl, and sought a third, or John has been with a girl and sought a third, or more rarely from a MF couple in the sex club scene seeking a guy who knows what he’s doing and who isn’t going to get attached.

The way it happens has a pretty firm pattern. We meet in a bar, and either I set the expectation or the other guy does. If the girl is mine I tell her that she can back out any time for any reason. I talked about how chicks need an open, low-pressure environment to really enjoy the f**king and this is similar. Girls also have narrower criteria for men, most often, than men do for women. For most guys, if a girl meets his minimum attraction threshold he’s happy to have a go. Usually we do a drink or two and then go back to my place, the other guy’s place, or a hotel. If I am leading I propose that we have a drink at mine, or that I should “get a place for us.” Everyone knows what that means. I give everyone a chance to say no. Sometimes I will strategically go to the bathroom for a few minutes or run out to “take a quick call” to give the couple a chance to talk, if I have not brought the girl. Girls really don’t like being pressured into things and I want to build in these moments to let her decide what she wants to do without having a guy staring her down panting for sex.

Continue reading “Threesome management. How to do and arrange FFM and MFM”

Sex skills for guys: psychology, preparation, and practice

Why’s there not more talk about the specifics of sex? I have some ideas… RedCoco says,

Pickup seems pretty quiet on the topic of sex skills.

I sense that as men we set our sexual baseline energy way too low when women are craving animalistic, dominant, rough sex from us.

We as men choose vanilla.

Women want the whole gelato bar!

I have a theory that most guys are not actually get laid much and the ones who are are not great in bed. I have been thinking about writing a “psychology of sex” essay to complement the sex-toy one (RPD wrote me, “Dude, thank you for the vibrator tip—chicks love that and it’s so easy”) … and now you have it. I haven’t written it because there are many good resources for sex skills, She Comes First being good. There is another one called The Sex God Method which is also fine. There is another one called Slow Sexthat is good for chicks who have trouble coming. Just F*ck Me! – What Women Want Men to Know About Taking Control in the Bedroom. So there are lots of resources for guys who want to get better at f**king, but not so many for guys who want to get better at seduction and pickup, so that is where the community hammers.

There is probably one thing that I think is useful above all others… take your time. Demonstrate to her that you are not in a rush… I made this mistake many times when I was younger. Most guys are so thrilled that a decent chick is getting naked that they want to rush through foreplay and to the stage when their dick is inside her. This is very rarely the best way to be… sometimes it’s necessary if you’re for example in a public bathroom or a car, but if you’re able, take your time. Guys warm up close to instantly, chicks warm up like an iron… slowly, but with great heat at the end. You never hear a girl say, “Oh God, it was so nice when he got inside me so fast! Wow! Next time I hope he is inside me even faster.” Chicks don’t say, “He came in two minutes flat, that was great.” But she will often complain that he skimps foreplay, she wasn’t fully aroused, she needed more kissing, she was still in her head, etc.

Continue reading “Sex skills for guys: psychology, preparation, and practice”

Sex club culture and socializing there

I heard from a player who went to a sex club for the first time, and he found about 70 people who were decently attractive, yet “there was no one that either of us was ‘wow’ over (a lot of the girls were still a bit chubby for my taste) but no one was terrible looking” (his girl is very hot, which I want to state for context… I have seen pics). His experience of the attractiveness level is decently typical… there are not a lot of wow girls, like solid 8s who are 18 – 25, at sex clubs. There are some but they are just not super common in life or at clubs… depends on the venue and night as well. If you bring an 8 and another 8 shows up, they will often gravitate to each other, as like finds like. In my experience there are not a lot of true 8s in life in general.

He also found that some people seemed unsure. At the clubs, some couples will appear to keep to themselves, because they don’t know the social etiquette. Since most other people are scared of approaching… in that kind of environment I am often the one who is initiating. Yes, some venues have rules stating that women must approach, etc., but in the real world that means they want guys with decent social skills who aren’t cruising. At bad events, socially retarded guys will just go from chick to chick, flagrantly hitting on each one and poisoning the atmosphere. We’ve all seen socially retarded guys and what they can do to a party, assuming they don’t get kicked out altogether. Think about those guys and how much worse they are at a sex club, and that is why the rules exist.

Especially if you start out talking guy to guy, you can chat with other people, as many women won’t initiate (players obviously know this). If you have a girl who is bolder than typical, you can encourage her to talk to other girls… girls know how to compliment another girl’s dress or hair or jewelry, they can talk about that for a minute or two. Common conversation topics are whether this is their first time, how they found the club or venue, etc. Really basic openers are fine, like “I saw you two and wanted to come say hi.” Even topics like whether they’ve fantasized about this kind of thing, etc. can work, in the right situation. Normal chitchat about jobs, etc. is also fine… like with normal dates, some normal chitchat that shows you’re not a lunatic and some sexual spikes/innuendoes show that you know what’s up. Read Krauser’s books for detail on this. Both normal topics and sexual spikes/innuendoes are fine and should be used together.

Most people are uncomfortable, scared, and don’t know the etiquette, so there can be a lot of discomfort at first. Many people who look closed off are just uncertain, so, if you can do some normal socializing, you will ease their mind… there is a popular imagination thing that anyone at a sex club is a crazed sex maniac, and you mostly want to avoid that impression. When you’re chatting, you can also do some classic Mystery/Neil Strauss set merges. Talk to one couple, excuse yourself to refresh your drink, talk to another couple, and then introduce couple 1 to couple 2. I am not an expert at this as I’m not naturally the life of the party, but a lot of people will appreciate some social lubrication, even if it is a bit clumsily done (I can be a bit clumsy).

The initial phase also seeds the possible later switches. I’m usually more eager to chat with the attractive women who I’d like to see more of later than with the less attractive women (and if the girl you’re with wants to chat with a couple, you should try to make that happen or help her make it happen). Women are often more interested in switching with someone they have had even one or two social interactions with, than they are with someone they have never spoken to (this maybe seems like a small thing to guys, but to a woman even one or two small social interactions can help you break the barrier between her and the outside world… one or two social interactions = this guy isn’t crazy = this guy might be safe = this guy is okay to have sex with).

For women, much more than for men, sex is an intensely social act. Many more men like anonymous hookups than women. Many men will pay sex workers for anonymous sex acts, and no women will do the same. Even the ultra-rare older woman who pays a man usually wants that payment to be embedded in a story about her vacation or whatever.

So, at the start of the club night, the party, whatever, demonstrate that you have a little bit of social acuity, that you can make small talk, that you’re embedded in a social world and not a murderous psycho loner of the kind all women have an instinctive aversion to. Will you see some chicks have sex with a man they’ve never spoken to, once the chick gets into her sex zone? You will. Is that the most regular thing you’ll see? No. Make the smarter moves.

When things start to heat up, you can sometimes invite another couple into the separate sex space, or onto a couch, or wherever, if you like them and you want to access that kind of energy. During the sex itself, the physical space matters… if there is a couple or a woman you’re interested in, try to have sex with your girl next to them… then, if you want to trade, the physical proximity is there. Girls will often touch other girls, especially… it’s also possible to see if you can touch the other girl a little, just ask first. Sometimes the other couple will say yes (cool), sometimes they will say no (also good feedback). It’s common to have sex with your girl, relax for a while, and then switch with another couple for round two.

Like I said, it’s a weird environment, especially for people who have never been to parties before or who have only been to one or two. Everyone knows why they’re there, and everyone knows that they’re going to be f**king in front of each other real soon. The atmosphere is powerfully charged in a way that can be similar to a normal date, when you and the girl know you’re heading towards f**king, but it’s different when it’s in a group.

I have a general point about non-monogamy relationships that work, “Couples that last put each other first.” At parties, smart couples work on “putting each other first.” They will be the ones checking in with each other if they need to. If they have rules, they stick to the rules. Sometimes I will ask, “What are your rules at parties?” Many couples have not adequately thought through their rules… if so, it’s often better to let them sort out their problems on their own. Often the guy will be more eager to switch than the girl… sometimes the opposite happens.

If you are like me, you want to search for more upscale venues. The downscale venues will be really grim, like downscale strip clubs. Chances are that most of you have at least wandered into a downscale strip club… they are filled with guys who look like they just got on parole and haven’t been in civilization in years, and strippers so busted I wouldn’t even upvote them on a dating app. People who are overweight or underweight or have other problems with lifestyle. Like with everything else, different venues will have different vibes that attract different kinds of people. A long time ago that I am trying to project a kind of hipster Don Draper vibe, so I want a venue that is going to match that decently. Like I have said, if the venue is off, if the people are off, if anything else feels wrong, leave. If you are an experienced guy you should be able to tell the difference between “feels uncomfortable because I’m in a new situation” as against “feels uncomfortable because there is something f**ked up here.”

I took a few minutes to re-read this and I find that it feels a little autistic, because of the paint-by-numbers, algorithmic description of socializing, but sex clubs are their own little world that don’t have widely understood social rules, so maybe being super explicit is worthwhile. It took me a lot of observation to be able to understand what’s really going on (the game is arguably just social hacking + escalation + looking good), and it’s easy to miss what’s really going on. I did, at first. Many of them also have this bullshit equalism rhetoric, which is not really true… in reality, the more attractive people are more popular, just like you’d predict, and just like the pretty girls and handsome dudes are more popular. Most chicks are not going to be into guys who they don’t perceive as being at least on their level… just like the rest of the world. You can find exceptions, you can be the exception if you are charismatic and have other things going for you, but the principle is there for a reason.

I do think I’ve learned a lot just by trying to articulate the things I think I have learned/discovered. The process of attempting to teach and explain educates not just the reader but the writer. Downside for the writer is of course a lot of unpaid time and effort. But I had not thought about all of this until began to explain what’s happening and how the game fits into the sex clubs.

If you like this post, it is now part of the free book about how to incorporate non-monogamy and sex clubs into the game. I got started writing this post because of a Twitter direct message that kept going and soon I had the key points of this post. Outsiders seem to believe that sex clubs are giant orgies with no consent and everyone uncontrollably f**king everyone, but in reality female mate choice rules and is very important.

The player also said

One observation I made of sex parties is that it is one of the few places you can’t use your phone. So socializing seems almost old fashioned. Honestly, the socializing is a lot of fun as it has an undercurrent of pending sex about it. You also are in a sorting phase where you are looking for connection with couples. I can see why parties are addictive – you can fail at finding someone … and then they just appear out of nowhere.

Sex clubs might be becoming more popular because they are one of the few phone-free environments left… people are fully present instead of being constantly attached to their electronics… the overall experience is far superior than most “social” venues today, where 60% of the average person’s attention is on their phone, leaving the social vibe dead.

Book updated again

Despite my big talk about no Internet on the weekends, I updated the book. It’s now 45,000 words, about 50% longer than the initial draft. I added a few sections based on reader stories and feedback. The section about socializing at clubs is the most valuable addition, and I’ll add an independent post from it next week.

The book is open source. If you have any feedback or experience, let me know, particularly if you go to a sex club. Nothing beats real world experience.

I have still not found any book like this one. If you know of any, please tell me about them too.

Americans are lying about their sexual desire: they want more variety and violence than you’ve been led to believe

Proof that Americans are lying about their sexual desires” says that anonymized data shows, “porn featuring violence against women is more popular among women than men.” Yeah, I could tell you that too. Women love rough, violent sex… from the right guy. From the wrong guy they hate and fear it. Who you are determines what she likes. Kind of like what I write in “The Startling Rise of Choking During Sex.”

Most guys don’t get this.

Unless you have read My Secret Garden, like you should have, right? Most guys don’t have the SMV, frame, or experience necessary to get it… if you’re a high SMV guy (to her), she wants to be choked, degraded, and manhandled. If you’re not (to her), she’ll accuse you of rape and write #metoo on her anonymous Twitter, naming you. This is not totally universal but female desire is much stronger and wants much more roughness than most guys know or understand. The roughness has to be done intelligently, like I write in the choking post, and she typically needs a lot of leadup to it and an “out” if she needs it, but if she wants it, she really wants it.

The frame thing is important and so is the SMV. I have had sky-high SMV to some chicks and 0 SMV to others. If she sees you as low SMV there’s probably nothing you can do to change it except move on. She’s not going to be into you. If she sees you as high SMV, you’re more likely to see very positive responses to rough sex (and that’s reported even by a very bluepill, feminized site like Vox.com).

The rough sex thing is a little like I say here, about gifts, and how women disdain gifts given to them by low-value supplicating guys. They LOVE earned gifts from high-value guys who give those gifs as a sign of affection. A sign that, while the guy could be fucking loads of other girls, he’s giving her a stuffed animal or diamond necklace.

Do chicks like gifts? Yes and no. Depends on the circumstances. That’s also why so much game advice is contradictory. It depends too much on context to make it universal. It’s also why a lot of beginner guys post bad advice. They’ve felt the elephant’s tail in a dark room and mistake it for the whole elephant. It’s not.

For guys, the problem is that many women will revise their opinions after she (or the guy) moves on. There’s no way around this, because rough, dominant sex binds a woman to the guy doing the rough sex, like going bar does. You as a guy should explore the woman’s boundaries and push them a little (without going way far over). She needs to feel safe even as she’s exploring what she really likes, and if you don’t ensure the safety too you will have a bad experience and so will she.

Porn featuring violence against women is also extremely popular among women. It is far more popular among women than men. I hate saying that because misogynists seem to love this fact. Fantasy life isn’t always politically correct.

The rate at which women watch violent porn is roughly the same in every part of the world. It isn’t correlated with how women are treated.

What feminists say women want and what actual women want often don’t match up. Remember that when you hear advice from women and especially women who identify as feminists.

This is one of the posts that’s half done, and I need to get it done and out there… I have too many sitting around in note form or partially written. In real life I am executing the lifestyle change that I have been talking about, assuming all goes well… no guarantees of course. As someone said, “The game will always be there” (he can identify himself if he wishes). But a particular woman may not be there… if a woman is smart and has her shit together and has a goal like having a family, she will pursue that goal and nix guys who aren’t going to give it to her. This is somewhat contrary to what you read online, where all chicks are available to a guy with sufficient frame, masculinity, etc. And some chicks will stick around against their better, cold-state judgment… some chicks will not, however. What a guy pursues depends on his stage of life and other factors.

Today there is no reason not to develop rough-sex skills, as you can search for “how do I have rough sex” and begin learning what you should do… you’ll find a lot of garbage but if you take notes and begin experimenting, you should get into the learning feedback loop rapidly.