Intense experiences in bed during sex: BDSM & analogues

People want primal, immediate, physical experiences, yet much of the modern world is set up to deny exactly that. As the modern world becomes more cerebral, disconnected, abstract, and disembodied, we want to get the opposite. There is nothing like the immediacy of fucking or fighting to bring out the intense and immediate. BDSM is now commonplace because women want it to be commonplace… chicks are the primary readers of 50 Shades of Grey, a book I tried to read but it was too bad to get past the first few pages… chicks are also the primary readers of its predecessor novel, 9 and 1/2 weeks. Someone like Aella can write, “Forceful sex is a primal way of taking away the stress of choosing a sufficiently high status mate – that I am not admitting anything about my sense of sexual self worth by having sex with his person.” And the “forceful” aspect increases the intensity of the experience, in a world where intense physical experiences are too rare. We evolved to have them, not to stare into a glass box ten hours a day. Psychedelics are becoming more popular because they also create immediacy and the feeling of immediacy.

I didn’t fully get this when I was younger, but when I was younger the world also hadn’t digitized to the extent it has now, so I didn’t need to. Today, guys have to learn to reject the smartphone way and accept the real-world way, and that’s especially true in bed. The best sexual experiences almost always happen when at least one person, and ideally both, “forget” everything else, forget themselves, and there’s only the other person and the sensation the other person generates in this world. BDSM is one way to achieve that, particularly for women, which is why the first link in this post goes to one about BDSM and how to achieve it. Too much “Do you like this?” and “Is this okay?” talk turns most chicks off, because they don’t want legalistic bullshit and posturing, they want a guy who “just gets it” and can read their signals. The downside of this common desire in chicks, however, is the risk for the guy that the chick will regret what she does and then make the typical accusations that we commonly see today. Unfortunately, if the guy can’t read her signals and generate powerful, primal experiences, she’s not going to like him (or sex with him) that much. I don’t see a solution to this dilemma apart from both dudes and chicks being consistently reasonable… ha, good luck with that.

I’m not denying that the abstract world of the mind is important. If I didn’t think it is, I would not be writing here, reading books, or doing the work I do. But there’s a lot of need for balance and the world is strongly imbalanced towards the abstract and cerebral right now. People deny their real physical tangible existence and suffer for it. Normal women love flirting in the real world, for example, but many guys and chicks are becoming the sorts of autists who can’t flirt. Solution? Online dating and paying for online dating, but that has all the problems that everyone today is aware of. One problem many modern guys have is that chicks will respond on chat apps or social media but never get together in real life, because the chicks suffer from the paradox of choice and moreover have forgotten how to exist in the real world.

Some guys are responding to this excess focus on the intellectual world by lifting weights, rock climbing, practicing bdsm, learning jiu-jitsu, or taking psychedelics (or MDMA).

We live in an instant gratification society. Most people want the digital instant gratification. But that is not how the real world works, especially the sexual real world, where chicks usually want more time to see the guy and get comfortable with the guy. Most good real-world things come from slowly building work efforts. Yes, it’s true that there are a small number of guys who get lots of good things handed to them by genetics and their families. Fine, whatever. For most guys, it’s all about the work you put in, every day. You only see the tip of the spear, one of the more important things I’ve ever written.

BDSM on average becomes more important as people spent more time on their screens and less time in reality. She doesn’t actually want to spend all the time on Instagram, she doesn’t know better. Are you going to help her become the person she really truly wants to be? If you are, that’s going to set you apart from the normal guy. Most guys are too busy playing video games to be that guy.

I was in my early 20s the first time a woman took my hands and put them around her neck. It shocked me. I didn’t know what I was doing. I think Google was around at that time but I didn’t think to search, “How do I choke a woman in bed safely?” I wrote her off as a one-off with unusual desires, not realizing that she’s closer to the norm than young red quest could imagine. I didn’t realize that many women, if not the majority, like being spanked and sometimes hit other ways in bed. I didn’t put a butt plug in a woman until I was in my 30s. I didn’t realize how those practices, done carefully and in a controlled enough way, activate the primal, immediate parts of the brain and shut off the chattering, doubting voice in the mind. Now that information, these kinds of stories, are out there, but most guys choose not to access them, choose not to stare at the darkness, the Apollonian world of the media pretending the Dionysian desires aren’t there. Dionysus asserts himself Saturday night, while Monday morning the woman wants to pretend Apollo rules, regrets what happened Saturday night in some cases, but, in many others, she loves those feelings, loves the man who can elicit them, when most men can’t. If you are reading this, you are reading a work about how not to be most men.

Lots of swings and lots of misses (FR)

[This happened before coronavirus shut the world down, but I didn’t put up the story right away.] 

Went to a party without a date… but I went with friends who vouched for me and functioned as dates. They brought extra girls (who weren’t appealing to me, physically or intellectually/psychologically, but that happens). The girls took some drug that made them very friendly.

I knew a few girls at the party, including this one (again)… and she is now ROUGH. When I first started seeing her I’d have given her an 8… by the time I wrote about cutting her loose she was more like a low 8/high 7 and now she is like a 6… not fat, exactly, but weird rolls of stomach fat and fat legs. I saw some girl going down on her and thought “She is only 26 and looks awful.” Her life is a trainwreck too, and the fall over a short period of time is a testament to the destructive power of drugs, even “legal” drugs (of the wrong kind and taken too frequently). I feel bad for her, because all of her relationships, whether with friends, lovers, roommates, etc., have been severed, often abruptly and in a difficult way, by her behavior… and she doesn’t appear to understand why. I pity her. Drugs and other problems are ruining her life and career. I may check in and see if she’s trying to get off them.

Met a couple who didn’t know each other well and had met recently… a couple who don’t know each other well and aren’t officially dating means that the girl may be up for grabs (something that I don’t think I thought to include in the book). The girl was somewhere between a high 6 and mid 7 but I liked her vibe… she was bouncing with excitement and pleasure when I met her, and enthusiasm is infectious, like coronavirus, but less dangerous. She’s also a kinky slut, and much later I picked up her contact details, and her dates’s.

Did a ton of spanking & flogging. Few people there appeared to know what they were doing with BDSM and the fact that I’ve developed those skills seemed to set me apart. Lots of audience, which started with me spanking my friend. Didn’t seem like anyone else brought floggers.

Closest shot on goal was a girl, Alyssa, who I spanked and who LIKED pain. I spanked another girl who was super cute, with a newbie boyfriend. Great to spank but said she has high pain tolerance (she doesn’t). Then her boyfriend wanted to be spanked, for some reason, to know what it was like? Not my favorite thing to do but it seemed like a moment when I ought to just go for it, so I did, and explained to him what I was doing, what I think about, how I check in with the girl, etc. So it was like half spanking, half tutorial. Couldn’t tell if I was getting bi vibes off him… I hope not. But the main way people learn this stuff is peer to peer, so I did some education? Don’t fully know how to interpret this, so the question marks.

Alyssa… I really worked over her ass and thighs. Long warm-up. Lots of flogging, eventually leading to full-on backhand, like a tennis player’s backstroke, with a paddle. The buildup allowed her to access that part of her. Most guys rush girls too much at every level, from the first kiss to the foreplay to the f**king, when girls want guys to move like 50% slower. Not so slow as to be languid, but more deliberately than most guys go. Be assertive enough for her to know your desire but understand chicks need more time than most guys give them. Alyssa did a lot of kind of annoying topping from the bottom, but I didn’t know her and so didn’t call her out on it. Spent a long time working her over, and interleaving touching gently and some kissing. Very passionate kissing. After, I asked her for sex and she said no but that she wanted to see me later. Later, we went to another area and talked, then made out some. I moved her around some, which she seemed to like, and set her up to grind. It was erotic, feeling her hips move and the sharp intakes of breath as she got going. I got about half hard, which she could feel, then she backed off again, saying she wasn’t into sex that night.

Some more negotiations followed and Alyssa didn’t want to f**k, Although she didn’t say it, she knew exactly what I was trying to do by heating her up, and she didn’t want to do it and only wanted to make out. She negged me by saying that I seem “goal oriented.” I laughed… she’s not wrong. Didn’t have a great response, honestly, because agreeing made me seem a little slimy, and the opposite wasn’t true and claiming not to be isn’t consisten with what she’d seen of my personality and skills. She wanted to know if I was going to stay and I was just like, “I’m tired and heading home.” Maybe could have played last cock standing but I believe the gold seam was played out and produced no nuggets, just a few flakes. With Alyssa I think she knew what was up, what her strict limits were for whatever reason, and that was that. She lives out of town, so I doubt I’ll see her again. Will follow up today but I’m not optimistic. I told this story to one player who said

There’s a weird negative vibe on chicks who are a “no” to f**king. It’s different from LMR. It’s like you can feel their mindset is set to No.

I lose interest pretty quickly if she is not at least open to f**king.

Part of the annoyance is when you sense on a limbic level that the purpose of her not f**king is due to a power dynamic and not because she is not ready/in the mood. It’s a huge turnoff.

I would offer a counter take on this… Alyssa wasn’t open last night but might be in the future. She was a forebrain override girl, one who liked that I had met a lot of people, spanked a lot of chicks, and demonstrated social competence and BDSM competence. There weren’t a lot of unoccupied cute girls. Transparently losing interest too fast is a mistake… it gives bad vibes to the girl and also f**ks up future events. I have her # and will ping her. A few weeks or months from now it could happen. She’s a good person to invite to random events when I don’t have anything else going on.

It’s bad to get the reputation as the guy who chases girls and then does a 180 when they won’t f**k right away. If the player abruptly pulls away once or twice, okay, lack of chemistry but it’s an undesirable reputation. There’s always the short play, in the moment, and the longer play, over time and over reputation. The discipline to make the longer play will lead to greater success, I think.

At the end, talked to a couple, the guy less hot than the girl, and the girl just gorgeous. Huge breasts on a very small and petite frame. I would’ve loved to f**k her. They’re relatively new to the world, so I took some contact info. Unlikely to go anywhere but some seeds have been planted. She’s the sort of girl who might look “okay” in street clothes and then turn out to be stunning naked.

Fair # of mismatched partners with girls much hotter than the guys.

Kinda miss the girl from the last big party, who I saw again once and has gone silent. Beautiful sexual chemistry with her, more than with anyone since Short Dancer, probably. Such quick sexual chemistry. Am I the same for her, or am I just some guy she f**ked? I’ll ping again in another week but going anywhere with her is doubtful. Relationships end, so I hope I’m top of mind when/if hers does.

The last couple events I have attended without a direct date, and that is doing this on hard mode. Harder mode anyway. Bringing a date leads to a higher probability of success.

I mean to write less but the inner voice speaks too loudly.

Learning

* Chat with people.

* Demonstrate competence. I learned how to do BDSM from a combination of online tutorials and guides and in-person. If you’re at an event and see someone who is doing it well, watch what they do and try to imitate it. Even ask them how they learned or what they were thinking about doing (after they’re done… never interrupt. Watch but don’t interrupt.)

* Play the long game.

“He is exactly the kind of partner a liberated woman is supposed to want, and yet she despises him for it”

I’ve been saying that women are the truest red pillers… now we see an article by a chick, about books written by chicks, that are as red pill as anything comes… it’s about whether a novel can “capture the contradictions of female desire,” but it’s not hard to understand… one just has to remember that chicks are random and also that many chicks don’t want to be accountable for their decisions. Seriously, the chicks writing the novels and the chick writing the article agree with me, just not in the exact framing I use…

Their behavior mystifies them, and they discover that the selective work of authorship can relieve their confusion: if they choose some moments from their past and discard others, if they arrange these moments in just the right way, they might be able to understand themselves as logical and consistent, free of the messy task of figuring out what they want, and the even messier one of fully accepting these wants.

When guys ask women logical questions about the woman’s behavior and don’t get logical answers, that’s often because the woman herself doesn’t know. “Their behavior mystifies them.” One thing most chicks hate, however, is boredom, as we see here.

Of the intervening years, we have learned that she married and abruptly divorced a kale-loving man, a classmate in her grad-school cohort, whom she describes as “nice” and “ever so understanding.” She is mocking him. He is exactly the kind of partner a liberated woman is supposed to want, and yet she despises him for it.

Nice guys are boring. “Liberated” women want what other women want.

Years after her ur-erotic hotel-room encounter, the narrator finds herself in another hotel room, this time with a man she has picked up in the bar downstairs. Her husband is at home and thinks she is away at a job interview or visiting friends; she can’t remember. Alone with the stranger, the narrator tells him that she wants to be dominated. This time she’s articulating her desire, rather than discovering it through someone else’s, and in the act of articulation she can’t help but come face to face with her own agency. But the fantasy itself is for the opposite: “I hate making choices,” she says.

If she wants it, the husband doesn’t matter, the previous agreements don’t matter… all that matters is the moment. The impressive thing is that she says she wants to be dominated. Most women want guys to intuit that, to just know it. But “I hate making choices…” that’s why smart guys minimize the choices chicks need to make. In the old world, the anthropological hunter-gatherer world and then the agricultural world, chicks didn’t have many choices to make. They married who their families, mostly their fathers and brothers, told them to marry. Now we are surprised that a lot of chicks are unhappy to be introduced into the world of intense mating competition and that many chicks are ambivalent about the choices in front of them. Chicks live in the land of maybe, but most guys are never taught this.

Most guys don’t understand what women want during sex, or how to give it to them…

This contrast—of women raring to assert their agency in one context, then willing, even eager, to relinquish it another—captured my interest in part because of its familiarity. I’d seen it crop up recently in widely praised works both written by and featuring brazen, outspoken, and almost always middle-class white women. It’s in Sally Rooney’s “Conversations with Friends,” when Frances tries unsuccessfully to get Nick—older, married, kind—to choke and hit her during sex. And in Rooney’s “Normal People,” when Marianne discloses to gentle, sensitive Connell, her on-again-off-again boyfriend, that another man has hit her with a belt, choked her—that she asked for it, enjoyed it.

Read from the right perspective, this “feminist” article in a feminist magazine about feminist novels tells us more about real chicks than most of the man-hating feminist writing. There are some dysfunctional women who hate men and some dysfunctional men who hate women, but most of all guys need to learn to understand chicks, and then their behavior becomes clearer. Chicks are often like random-number generators, a fact that explains my interactions with many chicks the interactions so many men have with chicks.

This article is great reading for confused guys.

Women are the truest red pillers.

BDSM dates & sex skills & online dating

Most guys still don’t know and can’t do BDSM, but Yoylo, who is working the game says, “I know it sounds a weird request – but how would you stage a sex date with a girl who has complained all her life about sex not being rough enough? I’m planning the date with the MILF for next week.”

Not odd/weird… there are lots of things to do… if you have space and money for a spanking bench, that is a nice touch (etsy seems to be the place to buy them, don’t know why, but check your local sex shops too). Many apartments/flats are too small for spanking benches. In thinking about BDSM… do the slow/teasing leadup… most girls complain that guys go too fast and are in too much of a hurry… so do the opposite. Sex skills for guys, and this one about vibrators, are also good posts with actionable advice applicable to BDSM dates.

Once you have read those two… you’ll understand some basics, so we’ll start when the chick is back at your apartment. If it’s one-on-one, start with kissing her, holding her neck, etc. When she is ready, collar her and put wrist and ankle restraints on her. You might use them, you might not. I wouldn’t gag her the first time, tempting as it is.

Have nipple clamps (key) and a collar.

Be ready with a butt plug and lube.

Talk dirty, tell her she’s a slut, etc.

As you are kissing her, strip her as typical when leading to sex. Play with her nipples and see how sensitive they are. If they’re very sensitive, she probably won’t like clamps. If they’re less sensitive, she’s more likely to. Don’t use clamps immediately, but when she’s very warmed up see if she’s interested in having them on her.

Eventually she’ll only be wearing her panties (assuming she’s wearing any). While she’s still standing, bend her over partially and begin spanking her. If you’ve never spanked a woman before, “How to spank a woman” in a search engine will give you good resources for this. Alternate spanking and caressing. Pay attention to her sounds and body. You may go back and forth with a paddle, or with a flogger.

It’s also reasonable to engage a leather paddle. Move to a wood one if you think she is not reaching her terminus. If you are swinging a wood paddle like a baseball bat and connecting with her ass… and it is not enough… then she is going into places I (personally) don’t want want to go. It’s getting too close to something like torture instead of bondage. There are chicks who go for that… I find it to be a real turnoff when she’s into that level of pain/suffering. For newbie chicks, hands and paddles are usually sufficient.

At some point you want to slide your hands in and begin touching her clit. If you’ve spanked her well and her body responds well, she will probably already be wet. This can go on for as little as four or five minutes or as long as 20 or 30, intermittently, with some gentle caressing in between.

Move her to the bed at some point, or the bench mentioned earlier. Like with sex, it’s not a bad idea to move spaces once or twice. Not so much as to break flow, but enough to keep her from getting bored or too acclimated. And go a little more slowly than you think. It’s tempting to just ratchet up rapidly. If you sense she’s getting bored or restless, ratchet up more quickly. For a lot of chicks, anticipation is as good or better than the execution.

Play with the restraints and with blindfolds. When she’s been spanked well, tie her to the bed and try going down on her and you will likely get a great response, for example. At some point just f**k her as you normally would, but incorporate spanking and choking into it. Hold her collar, lightly, perhaps. This can be dangerous because you don’t want to hurt her windpipe, so be careful with it.

Some chicks who like needles and who like a level of pain and bruising I’m not into. This chick would send me pictures of her entire ass and upper thighs turning black with bruising. I would hit her HARD with paddles, and she seemed to… not shrug it off, but I was not touching her innermost space. I consciously decided she goes too far for me… I don’t want to really beat up a woman, or leave her like that chick liked. I don’t want to mess with needles and blood. I have seen chicks who like that and I’m just not interested and don’t find it erotic. These girls are pretty rare.

Like with sex or symphonies, it’s good to have some mini crescendos, then back off, then build up again.

Like with business, proper preparation is ideal. For chicks, guys make things “just happen” so that the chick doesn’t have to do anything besides pick her outfit and bend over. Chicks live in a world where they just show up… and the guy has done the work… so do the work. Feminism’s noise about “equality” is bullshit. Most chicks want an experienced guy to show them the way.

So that’s my step-by-step towards a chick who has never had it rough enough. This is a scaleable action plan, because some chicks just want a little light spanking and paddling, which they’ve never had from their pussy, feminist boyfriends. Some chicks want extreme pain that I don’t want to get to. Most chicks won’t know where they are until you take them there, and ideally the chick will say “yellow” if you get her to that end state. A good dom is monitoring the chick carefully and backing off when necessary.

I don’t think Yoylo, who asked, really needed the above… it sounds like he’d gotten it all figured out before my reply and was prepared, but he was also ready to change based on the feel of the mood and other contingencies. Being prepared decreases any stress or anxiety in the moment… I have done a little description of prep to friends who say that it sounds like a lot of work. But then I point out that advance work improves the moment because you don’t have to worry about where the paddle is, whether the cuffs are available, how to tie her up, how to release her, etc.

Also, you don’t have to use the equipment at all, or not all of it, every time. You can just use what feels right and if she’s fatigued or you’re just done, you can have it and not need it. Like firearms and condoms, better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

My sense is that the BDSM market is not tapped properly online, unlike the general market. This guy, Andy has/had a BDSM Tinder profile that seems to have worked well for him. Will it work for you? No idea… if I had to try online dating again I would give this a shot, given how terrible most online dating has become. You have to decide for yourself.