“Just go talk to her:” how to think about meeting women

Xbtusd returns, with the ways talking to strangers has improved his game, and life.

I’ve been privately sharing some FRs with RPD and RQ over the summer, and I’ve started to notice some things shifting; RPD, for example, reports that some of his clients don’t stick around long because a lot of them need an accountability buddy more than they need specific dating tactics and strategies. They start approaching women, and instantly their results with women get better. To that end, I have to give credit to RPD, because I’ve never met anyone who so consistently cold approaches. He gave me a lot of confidence that yes, I too could and should approach more girls. It’s been amazing to have someone who I can always come to with n00b questions and, more importantly, an accountability buddy who wants me to succeed. Who would have predicted that speaking to women would be a crucial part of having sex with them?

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How to think about “future projection” on dates, and how to retain girls better

Sometime along the way to being a player, I figured out that it’s often useful to say something about date 2 when I’m on date 1 with a girl: mention cooking, for example, and say, “Come over for dinner, next time.” Then set a date, usually two days from the moment of the date. So if the date is Tuesday, shoot for Thursday, and feel out her schedule, and schedule that date.[1] Making things happen is man frame, accepting offers is woman frame. Text her the next day, “Good seeing you yesterday, and I’m looking forward to seeing you tomorrow at [time].” She can decline the date at that point (and sometimes does, it happens, it’s all in the game). My classic strategy has been one or two bars on date 1, then try to bounce her home, if possible, and my working theory has been that she’ll respect the effort to lay her, and the boldness, even if she says no. Magnum has used a two-date model successfully, which seems to reduce flakiness and female rejection due to self-perceived negative sluttiness. He thinks the two-date model helps with retention, and he may be right about that, although if the girl feels “on” during date one, he’ll lay her or at least try.

Game is about balancing tension and comfort, and I think most guys who get into the game and studying the game are nerds who tend towards too much comfort and insufficient edge.

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Paying for women (no, not that way: on dates)

Xbtusd tackles a perennial topic, coming at it from a different angle: should the guy pay on dates?

I have a distinct memory from high school, of a girl I was interested in, explaining how attractive women procure alcohol: she said they flirt with older guys who have fake IDs, giving the older guys the impression a hookup might be available, and then leverage that relationship to get alcohol.  I was furious when I learned this, but eventually asked the girls to ask the guys to buy me alcohol without telling the dudes it was for another dude.  Today we would call those dudes “simps,” but back then pretty much everyone was a simp.  Dudes with cars would DD (“designated driver”) for carloads of women ferrying them around from party to party and back to their houses all over town.  Often, these dudes didn’t even think they could hook up with the girls, they just wanted to be needed by attractive women for something.  To feel validated as a human and potential sexual option.  To feel seen.

That experience left a strong emotional mark on me at a formative age, and I vowed I’d never be like those pathetic losers.  In many ways that early experience served me, since they taught me to always avoid situations where you are giving away value and getting nothing.  In other ways I’ve hewed too strongly to this principle, for fear of the humiliation I associate with finding out I’ve been manipulated and turned into a simp.

In college, I was at a school where fraternities dominated the social scene.  I joined one of the most prominent frats and had the time of my life running the school’s social life.  Frats were an interesting social element because we simped for women, but always made sure it was transactional.  We spent tons of money throwing amazing parties, providing free alcohol to women, and, in exchange, the pussy flowed freely.  Most guys wish they had the opportunity to “pay,” however indirectly, for pussy in the way we did.  And yet, there were still nuances to the game.  A rival fraternity that some friends were in, took the simping way too far.  They shamelessly catered to women, playing whatever “gay” song of the day was on the top of all the freshman girls’ iPods at dance parties, and preparing non-beer drinks (unheard of) to get all the young girls who didn’t drink beer yet, drunk.  The more they swallowed their pride and gave the women what they wanted, the more their penises were swallowed by the youngest and hottest girls.  And yet, no girl who was not a freshman would be seen dead there, even if that’s where she had spent the majority of her freshman year.

There’s clearly some line where simping works, in the sense of “doing things for women,” but when you go too far, you lower your value, and women lose respect for you. Smart guys find that line. Where does courtesy end, and simping begin? Which brings me to my question: to pay or not to pay for women on dates?  I’ve always been of the opinion that if the woman wants to split, I split, and, if not, I assume I’ll pay: but I never insist and I don’t give them any pushback.

My girlfriend went on a first date with a guy last week, and one of the things she remarked on was that while she was in the bathroom he paid the bill without her knowing.  When he was ready to go he was like, “let’s get out of here,” and when she inquired about the bill he cooly remarked that he’d already taken care of it.  Smooth.  She considers herself a feminist, and has always insisted on paying half on dates, and she historically has gone on a lot of dates.  I’ve been questioning her reasoning, now that we’re in a relationship: why not let the guy pay?

She told me she found it incredibly sexy that he paid for her, and it felt to her similar to how she’s envisioned a sex worker feels. The man desires her so much that he wants to pay for access to her body.  She used the term, “worships my body.”  

On her second date with this guy he invited her to his place and offered to pay for her car home because he lives quite a ways away, and she’d be coming home late.  Again, she was incredibly turned on by this arrangement and said, “fuck feminism, this is so hot.”  

Quite a shift, and an intriguing one.

What’s the difference between simping, and fulfilling a masculine script?

Guys online, hearing his story, might call him a simp. I’d call him successful. 

Note: For context he is 18 years older than her so he is fulfilling a more older gentleman script which might be experienced differently if they were a similar age.

Red Quest here. I think it’s generally wise to pay for early dates, unless she absolutely insists on splitting, or unless you’ve had a miserable date and don’t want to see her again anyway. Protecting value is important, but not at the expense of masculine leadership and identity… though I’ve probably flip-flopped on this issue, depending on mood and recent experiences.

This also seems like an area where girls who are asked, by friends or when sober, will say, “I am a feminist and want to pay half on dates.” When girls are out with a man they’re attracted to, their feminine sides are more assertive, and they’ll like the man behaving like a man, so she can behave like a woman. It’s not what the girl says, it’s what she does… and who she does.

I’ve slept with annoying “feminist” girls who will make dumb claims like “there are no differences between men and women.” If girls make those kinds of claims, I ignore them, or steer the conversation in different directions… my goal is to f**k, not to have political arguments.

After this was published, I read “The Woman Crushing on the Guy From Her Mutual-Aid Group,” which includes the line, “Noah doesn’t buy my Uber home and I’m bitter.” It’s a common mistake to underestimate women’s pettiness and entitlement.

Peacocking, fashion, and a guy who tragically friend-zones himself

Xbtusd is back with more tales from the game.

My buddy is a successful Asian guy, in his 30s, and he winds up at a party with a bunch of Gen Z types, college and just post-college, who are there presumably doing what people try to do: hook up. My buddy’s wearing some very distinctive, polarizing things that also help conversation flow: he’s peacocking, in other words. His outfit helps him open a bunch of chicks, and some chicks even open him. Peacocking is an interesting strategy… I think peacocking needs to come off as both playful and masculine. The gap between “playful” and “goofy” can be narrow, but even goofy can work if the guy can transition to masculine dominance and identity. (Red Quest hasn’t done a lot of peacocking, he says). I’d guess that guys who peacock hard, like Mystery did, also need strong killer instinct and sexual vibe, otherwise they get friendzoned like I believe my buddy did. But he really friendzoned himself, by not acting on the girls expressing interest.

I’m going to bring race into the discussion, but also acknowledge that race serves as a proxy for a lot of things. I don’t want the discussion to get hung up on race in particular. Asian men are desexualized in American culture, black men are hypersexualized. Be aware of how you present. If you’re short, you might have to make up for that by being a little more masculine in other ways. If you’re Asian, you’re going to want to stay away from things that reinforce the stereotypes women already have about Asian men. Thus, when peacocking, you want to make sure you stay far from goofy, and do things that attract attention but in a masculine way. Maybe more in the vein of BDSM style gear. Race is just one factor for how women perceive you before you open your mouth, but it’s an important one.

According to my buddy, one hot girl was particularly interested, but he never tried to bang her, let alone kiss her. Wait, what—why? I ask him. He doesn’t entirely know. Is he afraid of the girl saying no? When I was young and dumb(er), I was afraid of “no.” He may be in effect friendzoning himself, if he doesn’t make the move. From my gf’s report, my buddy and the hot girl’s energy quickly grew into friend energy. The two of them became part of the project to facilitate my gf hooking up with a guy at the party she thought was hot. Having a shared project can be a fantastic narrative to allow you to bond with a woman, but you have to make sure the context of the shared project isn’t “friends,” but romantic partners who are building sexual chemistry. Escalation is key, in particular touch. Timing is critical, because the window can close quickly. Chicks are capricious, so when her buying temp is high, act.

Was he afraid to kiss her? I think he would say no, he’s not afraid of “no.” I think he is afraid of no.

Continue reading “Peacocking, fashion, and a guy who tragically friend-zones himself”

A threesome saga: energy & vibe

XBTUSD is back, now with a threesome story.

I was at an unbelievable, aspirational, can’t-believe-people-live-like-this party last week, thrown by a relatively new friend who lives in a stunning, straight-out-of-Architectural-Digest Brownstone with a stage/amphitheater built into the backyard and hot tub on the roof of the second floor looking into the backyard. The main event was a backyard concert featuring a South American band led by stunningly beautiful women. The host and owner has constructed an incredible universe and filled it with the exact kind of people one wants to spend one’s life around, including “Madison.” The party had the energy of freshman year of college, that first week when everyone is open to meeting new people. Strangely, for this type of event, no one there seemed to know each other. The party started an hour before showtime, so when I arrived everyone was already mingling and getting to know each other.

At one point during the show I was crowded close enough to where Madison stood that it would have been more awkward not to introduce myself, so I did and the conversation naturally flowed. She had an effervescent personality, and we immediately clicked. She was in town from the West coast and wanted tips on what to do while she was in the city. We eventually migrated indoors to have a little more privacy. The conversation quickly moved into intimate topics like sex, sexuality, and non-monogamy. Unsurprisingly she was in an ethically non-monogamous (ENM) relationship, and like most of the sluts I know was bi-sexual.

Around this point my gf joined us and the three of us hit it off.

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One of the hard parts about game and dating: when doing nothing is the best option

Game teaches men to control and channel our emotions, but one of the hardest parts about the game, in my experience and, it seems, in many others’, is doing nothing. Saying nothing. Not responding, when every emotional fiber of one’s being cries out to respond. Those are the times when a chick texts something, and I yearn to text back what I think, or to convince her to act, but in my rational mind, I know that saying zero is the right move, and that my emotional yearnings must be curtailed.

“Impatience” is often the handmaiden of failed game. A few days ago, I met a chick I’ve loosely known for about nine months. I have a lot of logistical complexity, and she has some too, and I’ve run hot and cold by accident, because I know I shouldn’t try to bang her, but she’s also a hot 8, and looks and smells like sex, so here I am, wanting to bang her.

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Dating unusual girls who have aspergers, or are non-reactive

Nash has a story about dating a peculiar girl, one who is “cold, confident, powerful little ‘push’ in how she receives you” and who seems to have a “bitchy hot girl routine.” Her responses to him are curt and highly factual, to the point Nash feels like “something is missing.” She’s a mystery (read the whole thing to understand more), and one possibility I posit in the comments: aspergers. She has little apparent interest in other people or a normal social life.

Psych diagnoses are overused today, granted, and lots of guys want to label unhappy chicks as “borderline personality disorder,” while 3/4 of chicks today claim to have “social anxiety disorder,” when the only actual disorder they might have is “7 hours a day staring at my smartphone disorder,” but in this chick, aspergers might fit, and that could also explain the lack of sexual debut, cause she’s too weird and antisocial to get there. I’ve obviously not met the chick Nash is describing, and sometimes it’s hard to say who’s just weird, and who is maybe diagnosably weird, but her behavior as described at least seems consistent with aspergers or similar.

I’ve run into some chicks who are a bit on the spectrum: if a girl likes to f**k for the usual reasons (sensation, orgasm, pleasure) but is also much more logical/systematic than a normal girl, she’s more likely than average to wind up doing non-monogamy, and thus I’m more likely to run into her.

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Don’t say anything, and instead change the debate

A player scheduled a date with a chick, then felt ill so he cancelled, then felt better and attempted to un-cancel (or reschedule, I guess) the date. The chick said she’s not free anymore and that she thinks he had other plans, and the other plans got cancelled. She “doesn’t believe in miracles.” Sounds like a girl who’s been around men and dating for a while.

So what would you do? Leave answers in the comments before you read on.

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Integrating smart drugs, like MDMA (molly), smartly

The average guy who regularly uses drugs like MDMA (molly), coke, etc., may seem from the outside like an idiot and may even be one, but the guys who use MDMA to lead better lives don’t look or act like the average drug idiot. You probably won’t know who they are, unless they tell you, or unless you see them at a venue on a night that’s conducive to the rolling experience. Without having had that experience, it’s impossible to describe how beautiful and life-affirming it can be: and, for those reasons, it can also be a powerful tool in terms of bonding with chicks, and elevating their lives. Loads of girls love different experiences (their typical life is dreary, except when men who up to create some excitement) and it’s possible to intelligently experiment with altered states of mind and body. That almost no guys writing about the game mention this (kind of obvious) point tells us about guys writing about the game… the main exception I can think of is Delicious Tacos, who’s not writing about the game, exactly, but sometimes tweets that the most effective pickup line in the world is, “Hey, want to do some coke?” I’m not saying that should be your line… but he has a point. Loads of guys disparage nightclubs, none of them ever say, “coke is a key part of doing that game successfully.” Personally I don’t want to do coke, but its effectiveness in certain environments remains.

MDMA is better, though, as mentioned above, impossible to describe without having taken it, but it will lower inhibitions, increase tactile sensations, create greater social cohesion, and have some other positive effects, like making people who take it more open and outgoing. A lot of ppl don’t like clubs/raves, then they take MDMA, then they’re suddenly great! If clubs/raves look stupid to you, that’s because you’ve never experienced them on drugs, which is the only way they make sense. Booming nightclubs are horrible environments, unless you’re drunk or on drugs. MDMA is a much better experience than alcohol.

Girls go out and have a couple of drinks on dates because the girls are nervous and they also want to get laid, without their nervous forebrain getting in the way of their p**sies.

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Coffee with a marginal chick, and the sex club multiplier (Keynesian)

Had coffee with a marginal chick, one I used to sleep and go to sex clubs with, cause she’s in town… high 6 for the most of the time I’ve known her, has probably slipped down to a 6 now, but she also wanted to f**k, yet I wasn’t that keen on her. She’d set aside a huge block of time to see me, and, by implication, a huge amount of time in which she’d get f**ked. Setting limits and boundaries with girls is a reversal of the typical order, since girls are usually the ones setting boundaries, delivering “let’s just be friends” (ljbf) talks, etc., but I’ve been thrust into that role numerous times, most often by girls at the lower end of my plausible range, and so I talked to this one before we met up and made my “no sex” excuse, feeling a bit like a chick with an ardorous suitor must. I also had some logistical obstacles that, absent them, I might’ve taken her for an easy tumble, despite things.

What’s off about her?

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