Low-cut top girl: first sex club experience, plus DRAMA

I took Low-cut top girl to a sex club last weekend, and, to spoil the story some, it was an unusual experience because MS. SLAV WAS THERE. She came in after a while, that is. Low-cut top girl and I had finished our first round already, which is good. I’d previously checked with Ms. Slav, and Ms. Slav told me she was going to a private event the same night, so I figured I was all good… Ms. Slav likes to f**k other people but does not seem to like it when I do the same: I think she is struggling for that reason.

So: Low-cut top girl is extremely boring and average in a lot of ways, and therefore I accelerated the usual development path somewhat because I am not sure about keeping her around… we had a long talk about what sex clubs are like, why I like going, etc. I had to lead her through the whole thing… what are the peak experiences in your life… yes, many of them are sexual… so what if you could try to experiment with real peak experiences… you know how boring normal parties are, right?… it’s not that much fun to stand around drinking and making dumb remarks to people… at parties, everyone is thinking about what everyone else looks like naked… etc. She is pretty conventional, not just sexually but in every aspect of her life. Still like her in bed, though.

I spent a couple hours walking through why sex clubs are fun and what happens there. I gave her a book, More Than Two, that she didn’t read because she’s too busy on her phone and social media. I framed this as a fun thing we can try and if she doesn’t like it, she doesn’t like it. This low-stakes framing is useful for ambivalent first-timers.

The night of, I told her to come over about an hour before I actually needed her to come over, which was smart because she was late getting ready. She does clean up nice, though. We got to the club at about the right time, an hour or so before things got started… lots of new faces there, along with some old friends, which made for a good mix. On bad nights there are no attractive people there and the best thing to do is leave. That is not a good introduction but it can happen. I encouraged her to kiss another girl and she did, and they both loved it and were very bashful after. I also got the other couple’s digits, an important point for later.

I like putting on a show and Low-cut top girl has some exhibitionist tendencies, so we were among the first wave to hit the main f**k space. I took loads of time going down on Low-cut top girl and using toys on her before f**king her. Another couple (different than the first) joined us, and the girl caressed and kissed Low-cut top girl, which she liked very much. They wanted to go further but I told them about Low-cut top girl’s first night status, meaning we were going to stick with each other, which they respected. I finished sooner than I would have liked but I was very stimulated and did not hold back well.

Such is the game… we put underwear back on, left to get a drink, and as we were hanging out near the bar and THERE WAS MS. SLAV, coming right towards us, like a monster in a monster movie. We saw each other about the same time. Having had this kind of collision before, I knew that there is no way forward other than brazenly, so I introduced Ms. Slav to my “lover” Low-cut top girl, and I asked Ms. Slav what relationship term she prefers… she picked lover too… so I introduced her to Low-cut top girl like it was very normal. Ms. Slav had some guy and a girl I know with her.

Ms. Slav was obviously angry. Obvious to me, I mean. I asked about the other party and why they didn’t go to it, and some kind of girl drama had made them change plans. I had told Ms. Slav that I might hit the sex club that night… I just didn’t specify who I’d be with. Like most public clubs, it requires men to have dates on some nights, and I would never go to a club on a night that admits unattached single men. Realistically I can go without a date on a couple night, as I’m a known quantity and know how to behave, but I prefer to bring one. We did some more chit-chat, then I said that I didn’t want to stop them.

When I let Ms. Slav and her dates go to the bar, I took Low-cut top girl to another part of the club… I wish the music had been quieter. Low-cut top girl wanted to know all about Ms. Slav and why I hadn’t told her about Ms. Slav… I told her that I hadn’t decided about her yet, and that she hadn’t proven herself to me one way or another. This confused her… angered her… aroused her a little bit. She wanted to know how many other girls I’m seeing, that kind of numbers thing that is not very interesting to people in the scene but very intersting to people outside it.

She seemed to get over her shock and we eventually went back to the main room… Ms. Slav and her dates went to one of the more private rooms, I think. We had sex again. Unfortunately, some guy came over and put his hand on her while we were f**king… and I was like “HEY BUDDY, NOT NOW.” That is a major etiquette breach. After we were done I had to go find the hosts and tell them about it.

On the way back Low-cut top girl was full of questions about Ms. Slav. She was very surprised, I think, by how hot Ms. Slav is… really hot young girls are disruptive to the social order. I think Low-cut top girl knows that she can’t compete on beauty alone. She, in particular, also can’t compete on intellect/achievement, although she thinks she is very samrt. People who think they’re brilliant but are not are very tiresome, but Low-cut top girl and I have (mostly) been f**king and not doing too many other things where I would have to listen to her.

She was still drugged up from the experience, despite us not taking drugs. There is a “slip into a magic world” quality that a good group sex experience has. Despite the Ms. Slav encounter the club was pretty good and had some attractive couples in it, though that isn’t guaranteed, and a bad first experience can turn an unsure girl against the whole environment forever. She even said she was surprised that cool/attractive people were there.

She also said she’d be up for dates with another couple. We’ll see about that one from the club… I may try to hook her up w/ a couple Ms. Slav and I have seen… the girl in that couple is fantastically hot. Guy seems not bad either, and he’s a personal trainer (but not an idiot), while she also works in an aspect of the fitness industry. The first time I f**ked her, she asked after how old I am… I told her to guess… she missed by like ten years… she seemed put off when she found out the answer, but I just said the usual, “Are you having a great experience tonight?” She said yes and I was like, “That’s all that matters.”

Our first club experience could also be the impetus for letting Low-cut top girl go, as she is not a good long-term person for me: she is not as hot as I’d like, and she can be annoying to be around at times. But I am also weak… there is a private event weekend after this one. Depending on what happens, I may try bringing her to that too. If I can get her in the scene, I will not have to field requests for moronic brunches and drinks she wants to go to. I think she wants to show me off, but I am lacking in the time necessary to deal. I also don’t like how much she drinks… I think it compromises her life and her body. Low-cut top girl also told me that she KNEW I am a fuckboy. She was hitting me and laughing at the same time. She seemed not to know her own emotions. Going to a f**k club can be like hitting molly, without the molly.

On Sunday I talked to Ms. Slav… she seemed angry that I hadn’t told her about Low-cut top girl. I told Ms. Slav that she does her own thing, and I also do my own thing. She said I should at least tell her. I told her that she never asked. Which is true. She just about never asks me. I have been seeing her less frequently… does she think I have taken monastic vows? We’ve talked about reciprocity before, and that is something she finally acknowledges she has some problems with. There was no resolution… Ms. Slav is also still dealing with family issues. No real resolution there. “Drift away” could be the resolution.

Monday night, I got a long text from Low-cut top girl saying that she doesn’t want to see me anymore because she is falling for me and knows that I will break her heart. I read this as, “Most of the guys she’s dated are more into her than she is into them, and she can’t believe the opposite is happening.” Because I haven’t immediately fallen for her, she is becoming more enchanted with me. She said that she knew I was too confident because of the way I stopped her on the street. (Originally she said she admired me for the some reason/behavior).

Overall Low-cut top girl’s trajectory is consistent with some other trajectories I have seen in the last ten years… some chicks are up for this and some are not. I’ve speculated that as many as 75% of chicks are up to sex clubs, and I think Low-cut top girl is among them… but seeing Ms. Slav at her first event, and seeing that I have other lovers, is too much for her. She needs a more gradual admission. Most chicks are NOT like Ms. Slav, who just plowed right in.

Despite Low-cut top girl’s proclamation, though, I put her in a group text with the other couple from the club, and we all now have plans to get drinks this weekend. Low-cut top girl and I have not been communicating, except through that group text… so she may cancel, not show up, etc. Chicks are random, as we all know. Then again she might show up. She has kept jumping away from me, only to be reeled back in by my non-reactivity.

There is no cure to human drama… the drama just changes shape, depending on the social structure of the humans involved. I have chosen a different social structure than most people, and it is LOWER drama than most social structures (I think). But I have also refused to commit to a primary partner recently, and that increases the drama level. Ms. Slav is too young. I need to get out of this scene and make my way into something else. My actions don’t match my words, though. I’m doing the things I’m used to doing… it has also been harder for me to connect with the women I’ve been seeing. Peaches, strangely, may be the woman I’ve felt closest to. I didn’t say emotions or feelings have to make sense. That kind of statement is usually an excuse, and maybe it is here, but it is where I am right now.

Apologies if some of this story is poorly organized: I began it Sunday and have been updating it along with events and random thoughts.

The second open-relationship, non-monogamy girl

A few months ago I wrote about Libido Girl, who opened me up to consensual non-monogamy and the sex club world. With and without her, I probably had sex with 15 – 20 women in the first year we were together. Most weekends we’d go to sex clubs or parties. Sometimes we’d go on dates with other couples. That 15 – 20 number could have been much higher, but we found a core group of 10 – 14 girls and couples we’d see pretty regularly. Just like with regular dating, every person has a finite amount of time and energy. It’s often hard to find the best chicks online because the best chicks, who know what they want and compromise well, get a boyfriend and disappear. They might appear online after breakups or when they move to a new area, but there is a distinct “market for lemons” problem that has become more severe in recent years (in my view).

Libido Girl and I basically maxed out our potential social calendar. We went more than I would naturally. She likely had more action that year than I did, simply because she had the energy and endurance. Towards the end we drifted more apart, which is a hazard of a lot of sex with a lot of different people. Her job situation was not ideal, and solving it involved her moving. Even before she moved, I began doing some online dating. This was in the mid to late 2000s, when online dating worked better (in my view) and chicks were not yet glued to their smartphones. I did well at online dating and upped my photography skills considerably and quickly. I’m also a better writer than most guys and often attract girls who appreciate that.

Flaking and other bad behavior was common then, as it is now, but I went on dates and figured out quickly that I wanted to sleep with a woman a couple of times, then try and get her to go to sex clubs with me. A few of those chicks met Libido Girl. I took one very young, wild, hot, and stupid/flighty girl to a club and she must have fucked half a dozen guys there, of her own volition, then basically ghosted me the next week. Which was fine with me, because it’s important for a pair who go to the sex club to operate as a team; if a girl won’t be a member of the team, she is not a good candidate (another potential subject for a post).

The next girl, let’s call her #2, was not as crazily libidinous as Libido Girl, but she liked sex and was pretty uninhibited about it. She was much less forward and in personality terms she was feminine and giggly. She had nice energy and was another solid 7 or so. She didn’t lead in most things but was happy to follow. She was also very positive, which is good for me, but she did like experimenting with other girls and had a very open mind. I think she was somewhat bored with conventional dating and was 26 when I met her: old enough to have some experience but not yet desperate for kids. As Libido Girl left, Girl #2 moved into her place, and I more or less absorbed her into the friend groups Libido Girl and I had formed. #2 never got into going to the gym with me, but she was young and had good enough genetics for that not to matter at the time.

#2 and I essentially repeated the Libido Girl process: for a year and a couple months we had lots of sex with each other and went to parties and clubs two – three times a month. I probably slept with another 15 – 20 girls during that period. Guys with low partner counts are endlessly interested in numbers, and guys with high partner counts don’t care, and by the time Libido Girl and I were halfway through our partnership I stopped caring about counts, to the extent I ever did. I had figured out how to integrate non-monogamy into my life. Some women ran away from that, but many did not. When a guy truly has “abundance mentality,” getting new women can become easy. I learned it then, or fully internalized it.

Not all the women I slept with were incredibly hot, but none were dogs and all met my own internal quality standards. It was common for couples who were unacceptable to hit on #2 (and me), but we were good at politely turning them down.

By now many of the individual parties and club nights have faded into a blur. I know some people keep records of who they did and so on, but I’m not one of them and prefer to exist in the moment.

The most notable thing about #2 was, to me, how easily she slid into the scene. I have written before that most of my favorite girls didn’t require that much “game” or persuasion. #2 was like that. She was ready to find what I offered her. Things came to end when she wanted to move in with me and get more serious. Which I did not want. At all. Finding the sex-positive and non-monogamous worlds felt like unlocking a superpower.

If I found a girl like #2 today, I might be more susceptible to her arguments and desires. At the time, it felt like the whole world was sexually open to me, in a way that I almost got when I was in college and immediately after, but my skills and mindset hadn’t yet come together properly.

Jealousy and non-monogamy

In response to “Feedback request: What do you want to see in a book about non-monogamy and players?“, Nash asks about jealousy.

I would be interested in jealousy. I’d like to hear not only “it can be avoided,” but some EXAMPLES of how it has come up, show both sides, and then your best practices, some case studies of how you’ve managed that in YOURSELF and the GIRLS.

Jealousy… I don’t think it can be wholly avoided, for most guys. It’s like pain in the gym. You’re going to feel it sometimes. Most guys, including me, don’t like to see other guys railing their chick, even if the guy and chick are dating casually. In my view, some amount of jealousy, however small, can come up when a guy is in a situation where he’s going to nail another chick and his chick is going to get nailed by another guy.

Jealousy is adaptive because jealous guys have, historically, been more likely to ensure that a chick is bearing his child and not some other guy’s. The vast, overwhelming majority of human existence (99.9999%) occurred before reliable contraceptives and DNA tests. We are not going to overcome our evolved instincts to do “mate guarding” (the term evolutionary biologists use). Not perfectly. This excerpt, from The Ape That Understood the Universe: How the Mind and Culture Evolve, further describes jealousy from an evolutionary perspective:

Throughout the course of our evolution, any trait that increased the chances that a man would end up investing in his own offspring, rather than the offspring of his good-looking next-door-neighbour, had a good chance of being selected. One such trait was jealousy – the kind of jealousy that would lead a man to keep a wary eye on his partner and the good-looking neighbour, and to do what he could to keep them apart.

For most guys, jealousy can’t be avoided. So if a guy wants to go down this path, he has to know that some amount of jealousy is probably coming and be psychologically prepared to experience it, before it happens. A guy can rationally understand that he’s doing a quid pro quo: he’s going to get his, so she’s going to get hers. This helps, but the jealous response is more emotional than rational. It is very hard to overcome emotional response through rational thoughts, but it can be done and for many guys must be done.

If a guy is in a casual relationship, he knows (intellectually) that the girl is probably sleeping with other dudes. How big a jump is it from knowing that intuitively to seeing it happen in front of you? A big one, emotionally, but a small one, intellectually, particularly if the guy is busy with another chick.

In addition, I deal with jealousy by focusing on the other chick. I wrote that Libido Girl, who properly introduced me to this world, made sure that I was having sex with another girl before she had sex with another guy. Smart girl. It is hard to get that angry while you are deep in another girl. She did check in with me after all four of us were done having sex, to see how I felt, and again later that night, and again the next morning. She was helping me to emotionally process what had happened.

Now I do something similar with most girls I’m introducing. I encourage them to go first, or for us to go concurrently. Often, we don’t have sex with other people on the first night we go to a club. I try to get them involved somewhat gradually, unless they are very gung ho, like Ms. Slav was.

Jealousy can be better overcome when you (the man) and your date agree to only bang other chicks together, or to only do a couple-to-couple swap. You don’t want her entering a threeway with another couple on her own volition. Problems often happen when another couple appears ready to swap, but then the other chick doesn’t want to do it. That way lies problems. A guy’s date must be willing to call off the sex, and both people in a couple have to look out for each other. If the other couple is not committed to equal swapping, the whole thing must stop. If the other guy is into it and his date is not, it all must stop. I have done this before. It’s like throwing the emergency brake.

Jealousy goes away over time, or a guy becomes acclimated to it. The first time a guy brings a date to his party, jealousy may be overwhelming. But as one becomes acclimated, it decreases. If someone is desperately scared of flying, a psychologist won’t get her on a plane right away. A psychologist will gradually ramp her up (first he’ll have her in a plane-like dwelling, then talk to her about it, etc.). Jealousy can be the same way. Now it’s normal for me to have sex in groups or trade couple-to-couple, so much of the jealous response is gone.

The other way I see people deal with jealousy is, realistically, boredom. Many couples have been together so long that they aren’t that sexually hot for each other anymore. For those guys, jealousy can be a bit useful, because it might make him want to “compete” for the woman he’s tired of listening to every day. Couples who have been together so long that they’re bored may feel less jealousy and, when they do feel jealousy, it may help them.

Another word about swapping: Guys who don’t want their chick to bang other guys are in for likely problems. If the chick is bisexual, she may be okay with seeking another woman, but other single women are called “unicorns” for a reason. This path is not impossible but it is also the route of much drama and nonsense. I’m not going to speak to it here because the reader can search for “unicorns and swingers” or “how do I find a unicorn” and read the endless shit written about this overdone topic.

To summarize, I don’t think there’s a single cure for jealousy because jealousy is evolutionarily adaptive. Jealousy can be overcome, but it can only be overcome by applying rational thinking to an emotional sphere, which has its own problems (I’m aware of them). It can also be overcome by the guy focusing on his own experiences: when you’re in another chick, who has the energy to feel jealous? These methods are imperfect and there is no final “right” answer. That is why everyone discussing swinging, open relationships, and polyamory online discusses jealousy. If there were a simple solution, everyone interested would do it, ending the discussions. But there is no simple, one-size-fits-all solution, so it’s probably the most-discussed topic in non-monogamy. Many people dream about a mate who is loyal while allowing some screwing around. In reality this is a rare circumstance. Many people attempt to resolve this dilemma through covert cheating. Some are merely miserable. Others try non-monogamy, as I do.

How to get chicks to go to the sex club

There is no single way I get chicks into the group-sex or open-relationship world, because every chick is a little different and needs different calibration. Libido Girl, who got me into the scene, is highly unusual, and I’ve not met many chicks like her. Since she got me into it, I’ve brought a bunch of chicks to clubs, but there’s a finesse to doing it well. A chick who is super sex-positive will be different than a chick who is sex-negative or comes from a highly religious background. Typically I don’t say anything about this part of my life and experience until we’ve been sleeping together for a while, at least a couple weeks, and by that time she’s more in my world than she is during the leadup to sex or immediate aftermath of it.

My personal vibe is also open to experience and non-judgmental, and that will make the girl more honest about what she’s into and what she’s done. I’m confident many chicks still lie or omit, and that’s fine, but they see what I do in bed and how I talk to them. In bed I use collars, restraints, blindfolds, floggers, and paddles in bed. I like making sex tapes. To me all that stuff is normal, to the point now that I forget most chicks aren’t used to a full-body, all out experience. I bring stuff out a little too quickly, leading to the, “Do you do this with every girl?” question.

(Typical response: “I look at sex as the ultimate experience and am with you, here, right now, and we’re learning about each other. I’m figuring out what you like and respond to. We’re in this together, and we’re exploring.” This basic suite of ideas overcomes that question, which can be a shit test but is really I think the chick being worried about me being a player and being worried about her just being another number. Which she often is, but we’ll leave that to the side.)

When I’m prepping a new chick, I’ll start by asking her about threesomes. What was her first threesome like? That phrasing is crucial: if a guy asks if she’s had a threesome, she’s less likely to admit it than if he asks how her first threesome was. Some chicks will say they haven’t had one. If they have, I’ll ask how’d it go? What were her partners like? If they haven’t had one, I’ll ask if they’ve fantasized about them.

Usually the girl will reciprocate and ask about my experiences, and I’ll tell her about my first threesome and one or two other experiences. I emphasize the idea that a girl typically has an amazing experience because the attention is on her. Two people kissing her, two people on her neck, one one her neck another going down on her, etc. In a sexually charged environment, like being nude in bed with the chick, this is often highly arousing to her.

This will lead to a segue into going to a party or club. “I’ve know this sex club, and we should go.” “Some people are having a sex party, and I want you to come with me.” Chicks rarely say yes immediately. They’ll usually have a barrage of questions about what it’s like, how I got into it, what I know about it, will I have sex with another chick there. But chicks, at least chicks I’m with, rarely reject the idea outright, either. Remember that it’s important for the chick to be sexually bonded before a guy brings this idea up. Sometimes I’ll make the inquiry overly soon, like I did with Bike Girl. That isn’t optimal, but if a guy senses a girl is deeply into him quickly, it can be done.

When I introduce the idea to a chick, I emphasize the fantasy aspect. This is about us living out her fantasies and exploring what she really likes. Most chicks, I think, have a robust fantasy life they’re too scared to seek out. Evolution has bequeathed most chicks with a certain conservatism, on the surface. That’s because most chicks who don’t do much, still get to reproduce. Some guy will come along and seduce her or make her his, and her genes will get into the next generation.

There is actually genetic evidence for this: geneticists have found that we’re descended from about eighty percent of the women who have ever reached reproductive age and about forty percent of the men. The average guy died without issue. The average chick had some babies. Chicks subconsciously know that they don’t have to try and should probably not try most things on their own. This is why chicks start fewer companies and far fewer chicks become important artists or scientists. Nothing drives them out to the bleeding edge.

Chicks typically look to guys for guidance about what to do and how to behave. This is also why guys don’t learn how to lead will never get their sex lives to where their sex lives should be. A lot of game is just leading a chick through the steps and into your bed. Chicks rarely take affirmative, direct actions to make their sex lives better. Instead, they wait for a guy to come along and make their lives happen.

As a younger guy, I didn’t understand why chicks won’t be proactive. Now I get it and have adjusted my behavior accordingly.

Most chicks are not very sexually experimental, on the surface. Many exceptions, like Libido Girl, exist, but game should target the median hot chick, and then game should be calibrated to the individual girl’s temperament. A deft guy can often bring chicks into his reality and do the things with her that she’ll deny to her friends and sometimes even herself. (“It’s not me who’s in charge, he’s just making me do this.”) Giving a chick plausible deniability is a good way to get her into bed. That’s why no one says, “Do you want to come back to my place for sex?” It’s always, “I have a bottle of wine.” “Let’s go watch a movie.” “Let’s play guitar.” When the chick says, “Okay, but I’m not having sex with you,” the guy says, “Who said anything about sex? It’s interesting that that’s on your mind.” Etc., etc. Standard game things.

The first chick I took to a club, after Libido Girl introduced me, was someone who I’d met previously at a business / networking event. I’d seen her for a while, she’d broken it off (I didn’t know how to handle non-monogamy then and was just getting disentangled from my co-parent) and she’d boomeranged back. I took her to some events and that’s when this whole thing began to click for me, and I figured out that parties are mostly about guys who want to trade chicks and thus get lots of casual sex on “easy mode.” Well, not that easy because the guy has to be attractive, socially skilled, and bring the hot chick in the first place. But if he has those elements in place, the sex part naturally flows.

So that is how I went from being taken to a party to taking other chicks in. The most interesting girl I brought is probably the one I mention here, from a couple years ago. She was a high 8 or maybe low 9 but didn’t act like it, or dress like it most of the time. I think she was young enough to not fully appreciate her SMV then. She was also introverted and didn’t behave in the hot young bitchy girl way, so we were uncommonly compatible. And if a guy brings in a true stunning chick, he will forever be the guy who can get hot chicks, thus opening many interesting experiences and doors.

Happy Fourth of July, to the Americans reading this. I’m going to a BBQ that is likely to be extremely boring (older people or kids). I’m at an age where hanging out with my chronological peers is a waste of time from a game perspective, but it’s an offer and we’ll see what happens.

Pickup Dark Arts: kink, group play, blowing her mind

Tom Torero just put up a podcast with Troy Francis on Pickup Dark Arts and I’m glad to hear someone else who is game-and Red Pill-aware discussing this facet of male-female interactions.

The podcast fits with one of the more recent pieces I wrote, “Sex parties and sex clubs could be the next level of game.” Kink and public or group sex aren’t for every guy. I love them both for their own sake and because I find that scene an easier route to lots of girls… for me. But:

The reality is that sexual marketplace value operates at sex clubs just like it does everywhere else. You cannot evade it. Using sex clubs to try and avoid having basic value and game will backfire and waste time. Most women assess men’s sex appeal in all the ways RP guys already know.

Kink and sex clubs are not substitute for game. Any guy who attempts to use them as substitutes will suffer.

Listen to the whole podcast. Guys who have never done more than light restraints and spanking will have their minds blown.

It is also my experience that the kink and sex club scenes will vary greatly from city to city, with the better scenes in the bigger cities.

Sex parties and sex clubs could be the next level of game

I’ve written about non-monogamy and sex clubs here, here, and here, in “How many women are open to sex parties and partner swapping? [intermediate/advanced].” There’s little reason to read this if you’re not already getting laid pretty regularly and you’re not already confident of your ability to to meet and sleep with new women.

Start there. When you’re able to get laid routinely, then read everything else here.

Sex clubs are not a shortcut to having real game. Sex clubs are an extension of existing game. If you don’t have game and status already you will have a bad time if you try to bring your only, sole, single girl with you. Guys like me will try to pick her off. We might succeed. Not only that, but a guy who pins everything to one girl may go emotionally nuts the first time she has sex with another guy in front of him, or indicates that she wants sex with another guy. Before you bring a girl into that situation you need to know that there’s another one behind her if or when she bolts.

[I have finally gotten around to putting together a complete guide to sex clubs and game. If you want a structured, comprehensive look at how this world works, check out the book.] 

In my view the basic dynamic of sex parties is guys exchanging hot females with a minimal amount of logistical bother. That’s it. People overcomplicate and overthink this. You have a hot girl. I have a hot girl. Let’s trade. The girl obviously has to like the other guy well enough (or want to fuck the girl).

This is the fundamental dynamic. It’s an exchange of value for value. I get more novelty than I’d have otherwise. You get more novelty than you’d have otherwise. Win-win. Fail to bring the value and you will likely fail at the sex club. Guys who have a bad time of game in general will also have a bad time if they manage to convince their one and only partner to come to a sex club with them.

Single women will sometimes come to sex clubs, and sometimes even attractive single women will come. Many guys will of course desire the single women for a threesome, and guys with sufficiently high status and good game are more likely to get them. Single women who are highly open to experience, highly bisexual, or with very high sex drives are the only ones likely to attend. Most women, of course, don’t do shit unless there is a guy ready to lead them. Exceptions tend to be ultra-high libido. Like, I’ve had a fairly long-term, off-and-on FWB who really, seriously wants to have sex twice a day, every day. You, the man reading this, may think, “Oh great mate, sign me up, I’d love to shag that much too.” The vast majority of guys, especially guys over the age of 25, will eventually be knackered by a really persistent woman, and she’s figured that out, so she needs multiple boyfriends or FWBs.

But she’s exceptional and unusual. Typical women at sex parties are brought by their primary partners. Typical guys want to swap with a girl who is at least on the level of the girl they’ve brought. It’s about exchanging value.

The basics of game still apply. Strong masculine identity and strong social skills lead to good outcomes. At parties and clubs lots of guys try to get “something for nothing” by offering to swap with couples nowhere near their level. Usually they are declined. Often by me. If you bring a girl to a sex party, be ready to say “no.” Be ready to lead.

Be ready to lead.

Be ready to lead. I know I’ve just written that three times in a row, but game-aware guys know that very few chicks will lead. They will really really not lead in most group sex situations. Some chicks will lead themselves a little bit more as they get relaxed and into the sex zone, but most won’t at the beginning. The fewer the people, the worse most chicks are at leading. So you, the man, will have to have the social deftness to make propositions and accept when they’re rejected. And when they’re accepted, which is scarier for some guys.

Most cities have a “scene” of some kind. I don’t know your city so I don’t know what it entails. In your city there will likely be a core nucleus of regulars, organizers, and people who make things happen. Show up enough and you will become one of them. If you’re a high-value guy who regularly brings hot chicks, you’ll be invited to events solo.

The worst clubs and parties are empty or filled with fatties. I walk away from those events. When I use online app matcher systems, I emphasize my interests in lifting and fitness, and this acts as a fattie repulsion system. Not perfectly, but well enough.

At the best events there are many hot couples or, more rarely, single unicorns. The hotter you are, the better you do. There is no such thing as a free lunch. Fantasize about a party full of gorgeous women aching for wild sex with you, but know that those don’t exist in real life. Because people are there for sex, guys can’t hold out much in the way of resources and commitment to attract women. What RP guys call “beta” or “niceguy” game works poorly.

Lots of threeways have happened with women or couples I’ve met through the scene. If you’re a reliable guy who brings hot girls to the parties and clubs, you’ll be in demand by other couples who want to swap. As you should know from reading Nancy Friday or some female erotica, lots of women fantasize about a threesome with two guys. Keep an eye out and you’ll find other guys, possibly game-aware, who may become your go-to “threesome friend.” You bring him in when you need a guy and vice-versa. It’s all about the value. If you’re providing value and he’s providing value, you’re golden.

Most guys are poorly equipped, psychologically and physically, for this role. But the right guy can be great. Like I said, he brings chicks, you bring chicks. He may have game, or he may just have a good social circle and persistence.

And, as for her, most girls know that most men can’t even articulate the girl’s fantasies, let alone fulfill them. Being able to move her from fantasy to reality will blow her mind and simultaneously draw her into your world. “Wait!” you might be thinking, “How is it that a threesome with another guy will bring her closer to you?”

Simple: she’s likely never been there before, and she knows that most guys will freak out if they hear her real fantasies. So any guy who can bring them up, listen without judgment, or even propose the kind of sex she’s dreamed about must be special. It takes social finesse to make these things happen, and she’ll know you have it, whereas other guys don’t.

Most women are very scared to share their fantasies. They fear, legitimately, that guys will shame them. Being a guy who doesn’t ever slut shame and lets her explore her bedroom desires will set you apart.

If you have a regular, uncommitted FWB you don’t want for an LTR, try bringing her. Maybe you’ll hate it. But it can be next-level game if you have the right stuff for it.

Most couples who come will be in committed relationships and they’ll be bored with each other. If you’re the guy who consistently brings in new hot women, you will be exceptional. You will be a star.

Some women will say no but many will be intrigued. I’ve been told many things. Like:

  • You are too experimental.
  • You are disgusting.
  • I would never do something like that.
  • I’m not that kind of girl.
  • I want a guy who respects me.

The first one is my fave. About a quarter of chicks have rejected me outright when I’ve proposed a sex club. I only do that after I’ve been sleeping with them for at least a couple weeks. About a quarter have been excited and enthusiastic and don’t need convincing. About half have been uncertain, but they will usually go if I encourage them and promise that we’ll start slow.

Many sex parties and clubs will pretend to be egalitarian and accept people of all body types. Ignore the rhetoric. The reality is that sexual marketplace value operates at sex clubs just like it does everywhere else. You cannot evade it. Using sex clubs to try to avoid having basic value and game will backfire and waste time. Guys who learn the game realize they need two things: value and a value delivery mechanism. Fail in either and the game won’t work. At the clubs, you will very rarely see young girls who like the degradation of sex with vile men, but that is rare. Most women assess men’s sex appeal in all the ways RP guys already know.

It’s not for all guys but except for Blackdragon I see almost no one writing about this. It’s a kind of ecosystem game that I’ve not seen players write about. But to me, it’s an extension of other kinds of game that can be much faster than opening girls on the street or online. But like I keep saying, it is not a shortcut. Try using it as a shortcut and you will be burned.