On Twitter there’s a dumb thread (the woman deleted it and I didn’t keep a copy… probably too embarrassing for her) about a chick complaining about guys using her for sex and then ditching her, usually after bad sex. That’s an easy diagnosis: she’s almost certainly chasing guys who are +2 or +3 above her in sexual market value (SMV). They’re not going to date her, they’re not going to try in bed, but, if she offers herself up, one of those guys will give her a tumble. I’ve been in the guy’s position before… my natural hunting ground is 7s: chicks less attractive than 7s aren’t of much interest to me, while chicks who are true 8s, are just not that common and are often particular. I’ve been with 8s and enjoyed relationships with 8s, but I don’t see/meet very many in everyday life, let alone bang them. I’m also just some hot chicks’s type, and when that happens I can cruise an 8 right into bed.
A few years ago (around the time I started writing on Reddit, or just before) I tried an app called Kinkd, which advertised itself as being something like Tinder or Feeld for kinky people, and, as players know, “kinky” = “easy & sex positive.” Downside, though, is that most openly kinky chicks are not the best looking. Fetlife has the online market pretty covered, but I gave Kinkd a shot and managed to meet two okay chicks, high 6s, without much work… both were novices and both liked that I knew about parties, events, etc. Don’t underestimate social proof in this area, either. Both chicks seemed like they might be 7s, based on their duplicitous pics, but real life reveals all. One was a straightforward, once-a-week lay for a couple weeks, and things ended when she said that “all guys are the same” because I said I liked her but didn’t think we are compatible for primary partnership. In a way, she was right… if she’s chasing guys +2 relative to her, guys like me will often take her for a spin but won’t buy. Rent/lease is enough. She delivers the ultimatum, we call her bluff. She repeats the process without recognizing her own complicity in it… many guys will take girls who “aren’t the best” if the girls offer easy, low-effort sex, as this girl did to me. Thanks hon! I liked busting my nut and when I closed my eyes, it was all good.
The other chick I did more or less the same thing with, although she was more reluctant to have actual sex. But the first time I saw her, I basically fingered her g-spot into a multi-minute orgasm of some kind (at least, she said it was). It was a strange experience for me and, I think, for her. Did do a lot of bonding in a small space, though, and, because my SMV was higher than hers and I also didn’t slut-shame her, she was into me fast. Too fast.
Both girls are the kind of chicks I am now mostly trying to turn down, as marginal notches. I also don’t want to get their hopes up as they invest me, only to be embittered when I say no.
It’s good for guys to give chicks a good sexual experience, even if the guy decides he’s not that into her. It’s not that much extra work, yet many guys don’t bother… most chicks are also responsive to toys, and something like an njoy pure wand is a good tool for both a chick a guy is into and one he isn’t (just for different reasons).
Female SMV is pretty straightforward for short-term activity and more complex over the long term. Male SMV is trickier and more contingent, since chicks have a wider array of factors they’re looking at and are just more arbitrary. But if a guy is getting consistent blowouts, his SMV is probably too low. Chicks are also herd animals and will value a guy with a girlfriend, even a low-status one, over a guy without one. Having one makes it easier to get the next. Guys can branch-swing too, although most lack the skill, discipline, game, and inclination to do so.
Most chicks who complain about pump-and-dumps are simply chasing guys too high above them. Chicks with reasonable expectations find what they want. People who have an accurate assessment of their SMV and act accordingly tend to do fine. This is more common among guys but still less common than it should be.
Everyone has the same options: improve their value; improve their game; change their environment. Chicks who are chasing guys +2 or +3 above them… are going to get the kind of outcomes this person is complaining about. This is the most common problem women who ask, “Why won’t guys commit to me?” have. They are almost never introspective enough to understand their own role.
Added: Another story, same basic situation. Mainstream writers won’t write frankly and honestly about SMV, particularly female SMV. That does a disservice to women, but the market for “You’re perfect, just the way you are” is much larger than the market for “This is how the real world works.” Most of us actively like our delusions and do not want to hear reality.
I am trying to write about things almost no one discusses. The role of female SMV in women who are repeatedly rejected almost never gets discussed, and, instead, it’s assumed that men are bad for “leading on” all these innocent women. In the real world, few of us are 100% innocent or 100% guilty, and most of us have egos that require someone else to be the bad guy, or girl.
30 thoughts on “Mismatched sexual market value (SMV): Diagnosis and cures”
This is why I’ve opted out of swipe dating, and why most people would be well advised to do likewise.
For guys: unless you’re truly Chad, you’re not matching with 7+ girls very often, if at all–most of the chicks you’re going to match with are going to be 6’s and below, and quite a bit older than what you can get using cold approach.
For girls: you can often match with guys 2-3 points above SMV, but you’re going to get the treatment this chick above is complaining about–the guy shows up to the date, probably is somewhat disappointed because you’ve altered/heavily edited/selected your pictures, but he’s already out, you’re super eager to fuck him cause he’s hot, and so after a few drinks the two of you fall into bed. Problem for the girl is that she wakes up stoked (even if the sex isn’t that good), and the guy wakes up ashamed–cue the after sex ghosting.
I was at Whole foods today. I ran into a lady that I met on Match a couple years back and briefly dated. I gave her the “Nice seeing you” line and walked away, realizing just how dramatically I had lowered my standards to do online dating.
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Yeah it’s pretty crazy. I downloaded the apps recently just to see and it was ridiculous–didn’t match with anyone above a 6, mostly women in their 30’s, and it’s like: I can regularly bang 7+ girls in their 20’s by doing cold approach.
The only thing I wonder about is using the paid version, simply because I’ve never paid for that stuff. I mean, if SOD worked, I would do it–it’s not that I’m opposed to the idea of easily being able to meet attractive women. It’s simply that this has never been my experience. I know my photo game could be stronger, but I still don’t know if that would make as much of a difference as I think. Anyway, would be interested to hear guys thoughts on that–I know RedQuest and Magnum use SOD at times, but my guess is they’re both really good looking dudes?
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I have not used conventional swipe apps in years. I have been using Feeld, primarily for couple-to-couple interactions, although I did get a random hot single chick off it the other day (an unusual occurrence that’s unique in my experience). Feeld is a different beast because it’s not focused on 1:1.
I also use it to supplement parties/clubs. E.g. many initial topics on it revolve around that. And I sometimes chat up chicks who I’ve seen, or who have seen me, at parties/clubs.
So I don’t have a ton of opinions on swipe apps. It does seem I hit a lot of the golden era of online dating, from about 2009 – 2015. Even then, I was off the conventional market for somewhat long periods of time w/ chicks I was seeing. Most of whom I met in real life, now that I think about it.
Hot chicks don’t need to use online methods unless they live on top of a mountain. All they need to do is walk into a hotel lobby, sit at the bar nursing a cocktail and wait. So, the majority are not even present on those sites.
That leaves the rest, who regularly receive hundreds, literally, of swipes and likes. The likelihood of her choosing you among those is statistically very low. You’d have to be a really heavy user and got great pics and a funny profile for a girl to respond.
Best leave it to meeting in real life. I don’t like cold cold approach, as many girls are turned off by that or are so used to be approached in particular ways that it’s old news to them. But, meeting someone naturally by being introduced or at an event where you’ve both been invited separately etc. has the highest likelihood of converting into a date for me.
Once on the date I always just try to enjoy the evening and the girl’s company and no more. That way, whatever the outcome, I’ve had a nice time. It also takes the pressure off of her and, in my experience she’s then in a good frame of mind to take things further.
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I don’t like cold cold approach, as many girls are turned off by that
I dunno… some are, some aren’t. Are you living in a big city?
Some chicks are turned off. Some blow me out. Others are turned on and HUGELY flattered. I’m not a big cold approach guy (lazy, plus haven’t needed to do that much of it) and even I have encountered girls who are THRILLED at male attention and say that most modern guys are pussies.
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So you write that men are more realistic with respect to a mismatch of SMV. How then would you recommend that a woman approaches a men, who seems to be unable to understand his impact on her? Once because he has heen cheated and left by his ex and second because he confuses sheer physical SMV with character SMV?
If one man doesn’t understand his impact on her, it’s time to find another one.
If you want character SMV, look for that, but realize it doesn’t always exist with physical SMV…